Do You See What I See, volume II

Jason Gregor
May 21 2009 08:00AM

lookingglass

Yes it is still relatively quiet around Hockeytown up here in Canada, but there is lots going on in hockey and the sports world.

>> A source close to the Oilers revealed to me that the Oilers have interviewed five coaches: Pat Quinn, Marc Crawford, Todd Richards, Rob Daum and Tom Renney. I still see Daum as the head man in Springfield next year, so I wonder if his interview was for the Oilers’ job or more of a “See where his head is at” type of conversation. Now that Geoff Ward’s Bruins are out expect him to get an interview soon, and Scott Arniel will get one when his Moose are done in the AHL playoffs. I wasn’t able to get confirmation whether or not the Devils will let Brent Sutter interview for the job.

>> Last year I was told by a few different scouts that the Springfield blueline was one of the worst they’d ever seen in over 20 years of covering the AHL. Not exactly a ringing endorsement. The Oilers are well aware of this blatant weakness and will address it over the summer. The signing of Johan Motin is a decent first step. Motin signed a three-year deal for a cap hit of $637,500.00. Motin won’t bring a lot of offence but reports are he is a decent first passer and a solid stay-at-home guy. Don’t expect to see him in Edmonton next year, but if he progresses the way they expect him to he might play a few games in 2010/2011.

>> I think Ovechkin is the best player in the game. He scores, hits, brings raw emotion and most of all he is the most entertaining. But Sidney Crosby’s performance in the playoff’s has put him right back in the conversation. Crosby is a better playmaker, and is just as competitive if not more.

The area he lacks, and this has nothing to do with greatness, but is hugely important from an entertainment aspect. Ovechkin is way more marketable and gives fans a glimpse of who he is. Crosby never seems happy. He rarely smiles or jokes during an interview or even in the game. Crosby’s personality makes him hard to like. He is great, but needs to show that he enjoys the game a bit more.

Lebron James’s persona is larger than life. Casual fans are attracted to that. Peyton Manning’s acting made him more acceptable in many fan’s eyes. Crosby needs to relax and let his guard down now and then. He is well on his way to being considered one of the all-time greats, but he needs to become more personable. More importantly the league needs it. If hockey wants to keep growing in the States, even at a turtle’s pace, they need their best players to be just as exciting off the ice as they are on the ice.

>> Say What? On Tuesday I had PJ Stock on my show, and he threw out this comment, “I don’t think Crosby is in the top-five best players in the game right now.” I know that guys like to be controversial at times, but there is no way Crosby isn’t a top-five player in today’s game. No way.

>> Say What Part II? Also on Tuesday, Bill Watters said this about Erik Cole, “He’s a perfect playoff type player. Hard and gritty.” I have no idea how people see Cole as this great playoff player. He has a whopping three assists in 15 games this year, and now has a sub-par six goals and 12 points in 40 career playoff games. How is that the perfect playoff performer?

Which begs the question, Is Wanye related to Bill Watters? Because they both are drinking the Cole-Aid.

>> The last year there wasn’t at least one player with two OT goals in the playoff was in 1999/2000 when there was a paltry nine OT games the entire playoffs. This year there has been 14 OT games, but no one has lit the lamp twice so far.

>> Does the winning goaltender of the Eastern conference final become the 3rd goalie for Canada at the 2010 Olympics? Cam Ward and Marc-Andre Fleury will both be making their 2nd Stanley Cup final if they win.

>> The teams with the least wiggle room under the cap heading into the summer are:

  • Philly is committed to 19 players at $53.9 million. (although if Rathje can’t play then they have 18 at $50.4 million.)
  • Detroit is committed to 16 players at $51.2 million.
  • Ottawa has 20 players at $50.9 million.
  • Pittsburgh has 14 players at $46.8 million.
  • Boston has 14 players at $46.7 million.
  • Washington has 14 players at $45.9 million.
  • San Jose has 13 players at $46.7 million.
  • Edmonton has 18 players at $46.9 million.
  • Calgary has 15 players at $46.8 million.
  • Buffalo has 15 players at $45.5 million.
  • The Rangers have 11 guys at $42.8 million.

>> If the Wings sign Hossa like many assume they will, and they get him for a $6 million cap hit, that puts them at the limit. Not only will they lose Mikael Samuelsson and Tomas Kocepky to free agency, they will have to sign and trade Jiri Hudler and probably one of their top four D-men. Brad Stuart will be the most likely to move.

Although maybe someone is willing to take Brian Rafalski and his $6 million ticket. This will be the first summer that Ken Holland will have to part with players he’d rather keep.

>> Some “character” free agents that should interest the Oilers, and any team that needs grit, and wouldn’t cost much include Dan Hinote, Rick Rypien, Travis Moen, Chris Neil, Scott Nichol and Ian Laperriere.

>> Players who should take a pay cut: Brian Gionta. Since his 48 goal season he has followed with 25, 22 and 20 goal seasons. He made $4 million last year, so I can’t see the Devils or anyone offering him that money again.

Alex Tangauy: Will someone pay him $5.25 million again? What about Saku Koivu at $4.75 million or Kovalev at $4.5 million. I can’t see how anyone signs them for that money. Erik Cole will take a home town discount from Carolina and will probably get les than the $4 million he made. Martin Havlat will be sought after, but I don’t see someone giving him $6 million again, but he’ll get something close.

>> And it looks like one of the best to ever play will hang them up this summer. Andy Lindahl from KOA radio in Denver said this yesterday on Just A Game on the TEAM 1260, “It sounds like Joe will retire once the Stanley Cup is awarded. He doesn’t want to take any of the hype away from the playoffs.” For my money Sakic is a first ballot hall-of-famer, and one of the classiest guys to ever play. He will be missed.

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One of Canada's most versatile sports personalities. Jason hosts The Jason Gregor Show, weekdays from 2 to 6 p.m., on TSN 1260, and he writes a column every Monday in the Edmonton Journal. You can follow him on Twitter at twitter.com/JasonGregor
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#51 airdawg
May 21 2009, 12:51PM
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@ Mikey: Did we have a choice...come on.

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#52 Mikey
May 21 2009, 12:55PM
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@ airdawg: My point was that usually when you give up your best player you aren't going to win the trade.

airdawg wrote:

TO OILERS TO DEVILS Travis Zajac Ales Hemsky Scott Clemmensen Tom Gilbert Or TO OILERS TO CANADIENS Jaroslav Halak Ales Hemsky Andrei Kostitsyn Marc-Andre Pouliot

Neither of those trades puts us ahead of where we would be if we just went out and signed a 2nd tier goalie this summer.

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#53 Hunter
May 21 2009, 12:56PM
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With contracts like Horcoff's and Penner's consistently mentioned among the worst among current players, Hemsky is a gift to the Oilers. It is easy to forget that he is only 25 years old... the best is still yet to come for this player. Hemsky signed for much less at a time when everybody else was jumping ship. How are we even talking about moving a player of this ilk?

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#54 Mikey
May 21 2009, 01:08PM
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@ Hunter: ask airdawg. Makes no sense to me.

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#55 airdawg
May 21 2009, 01:10PM
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@ Mikey: Name a 2nd tier goalie with a better contract than either of those guys. The Devils made the play-offs this year because of Clemmensen. Having Marty show him the ropes for the last couple of years will pay off. Zajac plays hard at both ends, been coached well and seems to have hands that need to be brought out. Good on face-offs and is a right handed shot.

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#56 airdawg
May 21 2009, 01:21PM
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@ Mikey: WE HAVE OTHER GOOD PLAYERS! Gagner, O'Sullivan, Cogliano, Brule and Eberle. How are those players different than guys like Bolland and Versteeg in Chicago or Burrows in Vancouver a couple years ago.

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#57 Archaeologuy
May 21 2009, 01:25PM
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airdawg wrote:

TO OILERS TO DEVILS Travis Zajac Ales Hemsky Scott Clemmensen Tom Gilbert Or TO OILERS TO CANADIENS Jaroslav Halak Ales Hemsky Andrei Kostitsyn Marc-Andre Pouliot

So are the Oilers trading away their consistent near point per game forward for the Canadiens' backup goalie or for the forward who managed to score less than Patrick O'Sullivan? Is Pouliot the tipping point needed for the Canadiens to do this deal?

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#58 Mikey
May 21 2009, 01:27PM
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@ airdawg: Well quite honestly they aren't as good. Only Gags and Cogs come close to being able to compare statistically to them.

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#59 Mikey
May 21 2009, 01:28PM
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..and O'Sullivan I guess but I would take those two Blackhawk players over all of them except for maybe Gagner.

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#60 Mike Krushelnyski
May 21 2009, 01:28PM
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@ Archaeologuy:

Well it's better than the other deal. Zajac is already a poor return for Gilbert, then you throw in Hemsky for a UFA just for fun.

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#61 Librarian Mike
May 21 2009, 01:30PM
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Jason, your comments about Crosby remind me of Mordecai Richler's dig about how Wayne Gretzky, for all his talent, is about the most boring person on the planet.

C'mon Sid. What do you think about......anything?

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#62 Archaeologuy
May 21 2009, 01:30PM
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airdawg wrote:

WE HAVE OTHER GOOD PLAYERS! Gagner, O’Sullivan, Cogliano, Brule and Eberle

None of whom have transformed their potential into reality. Eberle hasnt even played a game in the NHL. Those guys arent good players like Hemsky, they MIGHT be good players Hemsky one day.

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#63 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 01:33PM
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airdawg wrote:

TO OILERS TO DEVILS Travis Zajac Ales Hemsky Scott Clemmensen Tom Gilbert Or TO OILERS TO CANADIENS Jaroslav Halak Ales Hemsky Andrei Kostitsyn Marc-Andre Pouliot

Wow, those would both be horrible.

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#64 Mikey
May 21 2009, 01:35PM
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@ Ogden Brother: Tambellini would be run out of town.

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#65 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 01:36PM
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airdawg wrote:

@ Mikey: Name a 2nd tier goalie with a better contract than either of those guys. The Devils made the play-offs this year because of Clemmensen. Having Marty show him the ropes for the last couple of years will pay off. Zajac plays hard at both ends, been coached well and seems to have hands that need to be brought out. Good on face-offs and is a right handed shot.

Clemmensen is a UFA, and you don't win with the best contract. You win with the best team.

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#66 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 01:37PM
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airdawg wrote:

@ Mikey: WE HAVE OTHER GOOD PLAYERS! Gagner, O’Sullivan, Cogliano, Brule and Eberle. How are those players different than guys like Bolland and Versteeg in Chicago or Burrows in Vancouver a couple years ago.

Bolland/Vesteeg/Burrows are also all secondary players behind legit front liners.

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#67 Mikey
May 21 2009, 01:39PM
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Trading Hemsky should be the last thing on Tambellini's mind this summer I would hope.

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#68 airdawg
May 21 2009, 01:51PM
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@ Archaeologuy: Hemsky MIGHT be a top tier player one day to. I want Hemsky to do well because he's on the team I love. The breaking point was when he opened his mouth at the most important time of the season. That was him talking like a superstar. He is not. I want my best player to be a leader. He gives up and when he doesn't he's to ahead of himself. Great players can gauge that. Watch the game. PETR KLIMA.

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#69 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 01:52PM
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To Oilers:

Alex Ponikarosky Vesa Toskala

To Toronto

Hemsky Gilbert

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#70 airdawg
May 21 2009, 01:53PM
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Bolland/Vesteeg/Burrows are also all secondary players behind legit front liners.

Yeah...legit front liners...

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#71 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 01:54PM
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airdawg wrote:

@ Archaeologuy: Hemsky MIGHT be a top tier player one day to. I want Hemsky to do well because he’s on the team I love. The breaking point was when he opened his mouth at the most important time of the season. That was him talking like a superstar. He is not. I want my best player to be a leader. He gives up and when he doesn’t he’s to ahead of himself. Great players can gauge that. Watch the game. PETR KLIMA.

He may never be the Iggy/Vinny style leader/scorer that everyone pines for. But trading him simply to trade him is simply rediculous.

Talk about trading him for E Stall or an extended Nash, ya sure you'll get some discussiong.

Talk about trading him to trade him or for a back up goalie + second liner and you look like a lunatic.

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#72 airdawg
May 21 2009, 01:54PM
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oh brother...

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#73 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 01:55PM
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airdawg wrote:

Bolland/Vesteeg/Burrows are also all secondary players behind legit front liners. Yeah…legit front liners…

And no one is talking about trade the "legit front liners" ahead of those guys.

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#74 Archaeologuy
May 21 2009, 02:17PM
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airdawg wrote:

The breaking point was when he opened his mouth at the most important time of the season.

Right. I cant believe that Hemsky would answer a question directly asked of him and the answer might have seemed to undermine a coach that led the team out of the playoffs for 3 straight years. A coach who had lost the team and was subsequently fired. A coach who quit the team. I cant believe Hemsky made one small comment about him being used improperly.

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#75 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 02:20PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

airdawg wrote: The breaking point was when he opened his mouth at the most important time of the season. Right. I cant believe that Hemsky would answer a question directly asked of him and the answer might have seemed to undermine a coach that led the team out of the playoffs for 3 straight years. A coach who had lost the team and was subsequently fired. A coach who quit the team. I cant believe Hemsky made one small comment about him being used improperly.

You might be as bad as airdawg.

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#76 Chris
May 21 2009, 02:22PM
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Mikey wrote:

Trading Hemsky should be the last thing on Tambellini’s mind this summer I would hope.

Totally depends on the return. If Hemsky were to be moved for a more blood and guts type player, who could replace Hemsky's twenty goals, it may be worth considering. It's not off base for a GM to place more value on goals than assists. (Remembering that there are usually two assists awarded for every goal) So a guy like Dustin Brown, as previously suggested by Matheson, may be suitable return for Hemsky. There is too much "soft skill" on the Oilers roster; and Hemsky falls into that category... People can herald Hemsky as a PPG guy all they want, but Hemaky is really just an enigmatic, though talented, twenty goal guy who brings little other dimension to his game. (Yes Arch... Hemsky's a playmaker... Penner has sure seen dramatic increases in his goal totals thanks to Hemsky's stunning playmaking ability.) Let's journey into the super hypothetical: IF L.A were to aquire LeCavalier, and IF Lombardi decided Hemsky was the player he wanted on LeCavalier's wing, and IF Dustin Brown was offered to the Oilers... Tambellini would have to at least consider making that deal. Naturally there is always risk in moving a player of Hemsky's ability... the returning player had better have a much higher impact than Cole did...

I personally doubt that Hemsky will be moved because I don't see him being able to draw in a suitable replacement player that the Oilers can afford.

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#77 BigE57
May 21 2009, 02:25PM
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It seems a bit ludicrous that anyone would suggest trading the teams top point producer for essentially nothing. Obviously some people enjoy the extended off season way too much. The Oil need a bona fide goal scorer to play with Hemsky, if the off season goal isn't to find a shooter, than there isn't much point doing anything else. Sign Roloson for another year plus an option and give JDD 40% of the games next season so he can develop the experience he needs.

Sure the Oilers can make some depth moves but if the aren't going to find a legit shooter than any other moves are pretty much moot.

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#78 Archaeologuy
May 21 2009, 02:26PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

You might be as bad as airdawg.

I'm sorry. MacT DIDNT lead the team out of the playoffs for 3 straight years? He DIDNT lose the team? He DIDNT quit/resign/get fired for his ineptitude?

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#79 Mikey
May 21 2009, 02:26PM
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@ Chris: My point was that if the opportunity arrises then sure look into it. BUT Tambellini will not be out and about scheming trade scenarios with other GM's using Ales as his bargaining chip. Sorry, I just can't see it. Too many other glaring holes that need to be patched first.

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#80 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 02:28PM
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Chris wrote:

Mikey wrote: Trading Hemsky should be the last thing on Tambellini’s mind this summer I would hope. Totally depends on the return. If Hemsky were to be moved for a more blood and guts type player, who could replace Hemsky’s twenty goals, it may be worth considering. It’s not off base for a GM to place more value on goals than assists. (Remembering that there are usually two assists awarded for every goal) So a guy like Dustin Brown, as previously suggested by Matheson, may be suitable return for Hemsky. There is too much “soft skill” on the Oilers roster; and Hemsky falls into that category… People can herald Hemsky as a PPG guy all they want, but Hemaky is really just an enigmatic, though talented, twenty goal guy who brings little other dimension to his game. (Yes Arch… Hemsky’s a playmaker… Penner has sure seen dramatic increases in his goal totals thanks to Hemsky’s stunning playmaking ability.) Let’s journey into the super hypothetical: IF L.A were to aquire LeCavalier, and IF Lombardi decided Hemsky was the player he wanted on LeCavalier’s wing, and IF Dustin Brown was offered to the Oilers… Tambellini would have to at least consider making that deal. Naturally there is always risk in moving a player of Hemsky’s ability… the returning player had better have a much higher impact than Cole did… I personally doubt that Hemsky will be moved because I don’t see him being able to draw in a suitable replacement player that the Oilers can afford.

Are goals really valued that much higher then assists though? The AO vs Sid debate rages on... that should be proof enough that it's not so clear cut.

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#81 Quinn
May 21 2009, 02:29PM
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Chris wrote:

I personally doubt that Hemsky will be moved because I don’t see him being able to draw in a suitable replacement player that the Oilers can afford.

I think if you stopped at 'suitable replacement player' you might be more correct. There is nobody out there that the Oil can acquire to replace what Hemsky brings. Nobody. Period.

Complain about the vague insubstaintialities that you want in regards to Hemsky, he is still the best player on the Oil and the best overperformer for contract in the league.

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#82 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 02:30PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: You might be as bad as airdawg. I’m sorry. MacT DIDNT lead the team out of the playoffs for 3 straight years? He DIDNT lose the team? He DIDNT quit/resign/get fired for his ineptitude?

It's the constant grandstanding. You say he "quit the team" did he really? Did he quit on them?

Honestly, how much credit/blame can be placed on the 1 guy standing their in dress shoes vs the 20 guys on skates. What is the overall impact of the coach vs players during a season? 1%? 2%?

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#83 Mikey
May 21 2009, 02:33PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Are goals really valued that much higher then assists though? The AO vs Sid debate rages on… that should be proof enough that it’s not so clear cut.

To add to that thought:

Does that mean that Joe Thornton is less valuable than say (insert 60 goal & 30 assist guy). Each player gets 90 points but Joe only has 20 goals. Who is the better player?

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#84 Archaeologuy
May 21 2009, 02:42PM
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@ Ogden Brother: How much impact does a head coach have on a team? I would think that choosing who plays what position, when, for how long, during which scenarios, using which system has more than 1 or 2 percent of impact overall.

Yeah he quit the team. By the end of the season he isolated himself from the group and assignments were being given by the assistant coaches. Either that much is true or the MSM were just making it all up. That sounds like quitting to me.

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#85 Hemmertime
May 21 2009, 02:43PM
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Hunter wrote:

With contracts like Horcoff’s and Penner’s consistently mentioned among the worst among current players,

Thats normally because people think Horc is 7 mil cap hit. Probably only overpaid by a mil. If he had Penners contract no one would complain.

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#86 Mikey
May 21 2009, 02:48PM
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@ Hemmertime: But he doesn't.

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#87 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 02:49PM
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Mikey wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Are goals really valued that much higher then assists though? The AO vs Sid debate rages on… that should be proof enough that it’s not so clear cut. To add to that thought: Does that mean that Joe Thornton is less valuable than say (insert 60 goal & 30 assist guy). Each player gets 90 points but Joe only has 20 goals. Who is the better player?

I personally prefer the goal scorer, but theirs no question it's still up for debate.

Hull was doubling Gretz goals during his big years, yet most still took Gretz over Hull.

Thorton won the Hart with 29 goals when Jagr scored 54.

Crosby won the Hart with 36 goals when Heatly/Vinny were both over 50.

Datsyuk/Malkin are up for the Heart dispite being 14th/23rd in goal scoring.

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#88 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 02:59PM
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Hemmertime wrote:

Hunter wrote: With contracts like Horcoff’s and Penner’s consistently mentioned among the worst among current players, Thats normally because people think Horc is 7 mil cap hit. Probably only overpaid by a mil. If he had Penners contract no one would complain.

They are both likely .5 to 1 million overpaid (cap hit), yet with the way people get their panties in a knot you'd think they were 3-4 million over.

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#89 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 03:14PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: How much impact does a head coach have on a team? I would think that choosing who plays what position, when, for how long, during which scenarios, using which system has more than 1 or 2 percent of impact overall. Yeah he quit the team. By the end of the season he isolated himself from the group and assignments were being given by the assistant coaches. Either that much is true or the MSM were just making it all up. That sounds like quitting to me.

So what's the % then? Remember, each time you bump the coaching credit/blame notch up you reduce the 20 players actually on the ice.

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#90 J-Bird
May 21 2009, 03:15PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Archaeologuy wrote: Ogden Brother wrote: You might be as bad as airdawg. I’m sorry. MacT DIDNT lead the team out of the playoffs for 3 straight years? He DIDNT lose the team? He DIDNT quit/resign/get fired for his ineptitude? It’s the constant grandstanding. You say he “quit the team” did he really? Did he quit on them? Honestly, how much credit/blame can be placed on the 1 guy standing their in dress shoes vs the 20 guys on skates. What is the overall impact of the coach vs players during a season? 1%? 2%?

All I can say is that schemes and systems play account for more than 1 or 2%. Playing Pisani and Moreau on the powerplay is more than 1 or 2%. His use of Penner is more than 1 or 2%. His overuse of others too. It was more than a percent or two IMO. Reddox can thank Mac 100% for him being a full time NHLer.

That said, this year, wasn't on MacT. This year was on K-Lowe. Mac didn't ask for 3 goalies, didn't ask for no centres who can win the odd draw, didn't ask for his top 2 PK guys to be moved and not replaced, etc. Mac had to do what he had to do in some sense.

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#91 Chris
May 21 2009, 03:32PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Hull was doubling Gretz goals during his big years, yet most still took Gretz over Hull

Gretz scored 894 goals and 1963 assists. That is 2.19 assists for every goal he scored.

Hemsky has scored 70 goals and 195 assists. That is 2.79 assists for every goal.

Again, when you consider that two assists are usually awarded for every goal, Gretzky was more statistically balanced; as both a goal scorer, and playmaker; than many of us would imagine.

Hemsky is the go-to play maker on a team that doesn't score. Many of Hemsky's "brilliant plays" are as simple as passing the puck back to the point, so Souray can blast it home. Sometimes I wonder if Hemsky's totals are inflated by being the key guy on an otherwise offensively challenged team. If Hemsky was traded to Detroit, do you think his totals would increase thanks to more skilled linmates... or would more skilled teamates rob him of the quality ice time he is given as an Oiler? Many on this site assume that Horcoff and Penner are holding Hemsky back. IMO Hemsky, is holding Hemsky back. I don't see much of an attitude difference between Nilsson and Hemsky... Hemsky is simply more skilled. It's about attitude. Hemsky has been a pro for six years; it's time to show some commitment to getting stronger on the puck.

For example: Hemsky skates waaaay better than Gagner. Hemsky has a better shot than Gagner. Hemsky can do things at speed with the puck Gagner will never do... Yet Gagner is tracking ahead of where Hemsky was at this stage in his development... Why? Commitment. Q. What is wrong with the Oilers? A. Lack of commitment. I have heard on the radio the Oilers skating coach (don't remember his name) say that Hemsky is the Oilers best skater. (Not necessarily faster than Cogliono but a better overall skater) IMO Hemsky has as good a shot as Camalleri. With these tools, and with his stature on the team Hemsky needs to score more. He wants to be a play-maker? Fine! The Greatest Playmaker of all scored one goal for every 2.19 assists. If Hemsky applied that standard; he would be a thirty goal guy... and THAT is what the Oilers need.

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#92 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 03:32PM
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J-Bird wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Archaeologuy wrote: Ogden Brother wrote: You might be as bad as airdawg. I’m sorry. MacT DIDNT lead the team out of the playoffs for 3 straight years? He DIDNT lose the team? He DIDNT quit/resign/get fired for his ineptitude? It’s the constant grandstanding. You say he “quit the team” did he really? Did he quit on them? Honestly, how much credit/blame can be placed on the 1 guy standing their in dress shoes vs the 20 guys on skates. What is the overall impact of the coach vs players during a season? 1%? 2%? All I can say is that schemes and systems play account for more than 1 or 2%. Playing Pisani and Moreau on the powerplay is more than 1 or 2%. His use of Penner is more than 1 or 2%. His overuse of others too. It was more than a percent or two IMO. Reddox can thank Mac 100% for him being a full time NHLer. That said, this year, wasn’t on MacT. This year was on K-Lowe. Mac didn’t ask for 3 goalies, didn’t ask for no centres who can win the odd draw, didn’t ask for his top 2 PK guys to be moved and not replaced, etc. Mac had to do what he had to do in some sense.

So why do the players take little to no blame? (note, they were what? 3 wins and a tie away from where they should have been on paper?)

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#93 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 03:37PM
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Chris wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Hull was doubling Gretz goals during his big years, yet most still took Gretz over Hull Gretz scored 894 goals and 1963 assists. That is 2.19 assists for every goal he scored. Hemsky has scored 70 goals and 195 assists. That is 2.79 assists for every goal. Again, when you consider that two assists are usually awarded for every goal, Gretzky was more statistically balanced; as both a goal scorer, and playmaker; than many of us would imagine. Hemsky is the go-to play maker on a team that doesn’t score. Many of Hemsky’s “brilliant plays” are as simple as passing the puck back to the point, so Souray can blast it home. Sometimes I wonder if Hemsky’s totals are inflated by being the key guy on an otherwise offensively challenged team. If Hemsky was traded to Detroit, do you think his totals would increase thanks to more skilled linmates… or would more skilled teamates rob him of the quality ice time he is given as an Oiler? Many on this site assume that Horcoff and Penner are holding Hemsky back. IMO Hemsky, is holding Hemsky back. I don’t see much of an attitude difference between Nilsson and Hemsky… Hemsky is simply more skilled. It’s about attitude. Hemsky has been a pro for six years; it’s time to show some commitment to getting stronger on the puck. For example: Hemsky skates waaaay better than Gagner. Hemsky has a better shot than Gagner. Hemsky can do things at speed with the puck Gagner will never do… Yet Gagner is tracking ahead of where Hemsky was at this stage in his development… Why? Commitment. Q. What is wrong with the Oilers? A. Lack of commitment. I have heard on the radio the Oilers skating coach (don’t remember his name) say that Hemsky is the Oilers best skater. (Not necessarily faster than Cogliono but a better overall skater) IMO Hemsky has as good a shot as Camalleri. With these tools, and with his stature on the team Hemsky needs to score more. He wants to be a play-maker? Fine! The Greatest Playmaker of all scored one goal for every 2.19 assists. If Hemsky applied that standard; he would be a thirty goal guy… and THAT is what the Oilers need.

Just a comment on your one line: "otherwise offensively challenged team"

Is the team really offensively challanged? look at what they've had on paper the last 2 - 4 - 8 years and cross refrence that to where they ended up in total scoring in the conference.

If anything this team typically over achieves offensively and underachieves defensively.

But ya I agree with your premis on his scoring, I would bet his production would go up, not down if he was moved to Det.

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#94 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 03:41PM
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Oops: Meant "Down not up"

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#95 Mikey
May 21 2009, 03:43PM
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Chris wrote:

don’t see much of an attitude difference between Nilsson and Hemsky… Hemsky is simply more skilled.

Have you seen them in practice? I have heard that Nilsson is extremely skilled. Just wondering what you are basing this on.Chris wrote:

I have heard on the radio the Oilers skating coach (don’t remember his name) say that Hemsky is the Oilers best skater. (Not necessarily faster than Cogliono but a better overall skater) IMO Hemsky has as good a shot as Camalleri

Yet you think he is overrated by fans here?

Hemsky is NOT the problem with this team. He isn't even one of them. He is over-producing his contract so why all this conversation about him?

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#96 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 03:51PM
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Mikey wrote:

Chris wrote: don’t see much of an attitude difference between Nilsson and Hemsky… Hemsky is simply more skilled. Have you seen them in practice? I have heard that Nilsson is extremely skilled. Just wondering what you are basing this on.Chris wrote: I have heard on the radio the Oilers skating coach (don’t remember his name) say that Hemsky is the Oilers best skater. (Not necessarily faster than Cogliono but a better overall skater) IMO Hemsky has as good a shot as Camalleri Yet you think he is overrated by fans here? Hemsky is NOT the problem with this team. He isn’t even one of them. He is over-producing his contract so why all this conversation about him?

I think the issue is that he's underperforming his skill set.

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#97 Chris
May 21 2009, 03:52PM
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@ Ogden Brother:

It's kind of funny how my knock on Hemsky is his failure to shift his focus to scoring goals...

But last season he did a nice job of doing just that: Carreer AVG: 2.79 assists for every goal. Last season: 1.89 assists for every goal.

Maybe I'm just wrong to think he can be a thirty goal guy... Maybe we are all crazy to get so worked up about just another twenty goal scorer. I don't know...

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#98 Mikey
May 21 2009, 03:54PM
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@ Ogden Brother: Where does it say what he SHOULD be producing though? Is it so bad if he is a 80-85 point player for his career?

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#99 Chris
May 21 2009, 03:59PM
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@ Mikey:

Yes. I am probably over-rating Hemsky's skill set... but not his overall contribution/importance to the Oilers. I'd trade him for a guy like Dustin Brown; though most posters here wouldn't.

At the end of the day, all that really matters, is that Lombardi would NEVER trade his young captain for a floater like Hemmer.

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#100 Ogden Brother
May 21 2009, 04:00PM
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Mikey wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: Where does it say what he SHOULD be producing though? Is it so bad if he is a 80-85 point player for his career?

For all the reasons you've listed. He's fast, great moves, great shot, not afraid to go to traffic ect ect. Theirs no reason what so ever he shouldn't be an 85 - 95 point guy... he might still get their, but he better hurry.

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