Five things: No, wait

Ryan Lambert
October 10 2013 08:37AM

1. Third-period leads

The Flames have to this point in the season done exceedingly well at scoring a lot of goals (four per game) and usually enter the third period with a lead, which is a good thing to do if you want to win hockey games.

This is a team that seems very good a building leads and, as you might expect given the makeup of the roster, very bad at holding them. What was interesting to me is that they've actually only allowed one more goal in the third period than they scored, because it seemed like it should be a lot more than that. It's kind of amazing that they could enter two of their three games with a lead going into the third period — which those who think they're playoff competitors must be heartened by — but they didn't win either of those games. Their only win of the season came in a game in which they were tied after 40 minutes.

Not that you wouldn't expect this kind of thing out of a young and/or bad team because that's almost always what separates good teams from those that are not so much good. The Flames are the latter and have been this whole time; they bleed goals and they can't hold leads and even if they're scoring a lot it's because they're shooting 11.4 percent (before the game last night). Meanwhile, they're only stopping 87.9 percent of shots. Neither is sustainable, obviously, but I know which is probably at least a little more sustainable.

2. This isn't right at all

Of course people in Calgary have been heartened by these performances. "If they're going to lose, at least make it entertaining" and all that, and the Flames have to their credit delivered. No one expected them to score 12 goals in their first three games considering who was playing and who was on the shelf and who was shipped out of town last year.

But obviously the people who want a tank-job have been ripping their hair out: Four points from three games? This is the kind of thing that's always been frustrating about the Flames. They get almost to where they need to be (in this case conceding lots of third-period goals and getting no goaltending to speak of), but also don't quite get there. That thing Kent said a while ago about the difference in results when the expectations change is true. People seem, from what I've seen, to be perfectly happy with four points from three games, but this kind of thing last year with the blown leads and so forth would have made people scream and hold their breath.

This is all going to catch up with them eventually, of course, and I still think this is a truly bottom-of-the-barrel team, but the success, such as it is lately, is extremely counterproductive.

3. Monahan's production

Something that is less counter-productive, but could soon become so if things go as some are starting to expect, is once again the Monahan Issue. Obviously through three games he's a point a game player and in the attacking zone he's looked very, very good.

But what's gone less noticed, mostly because of the context in which it's happened, is that while he was on the ice for three goals for at even strength in the first three games, he's also been on the ice for seven goals against, including four in the Canucks game alone. He has, to my eyes, looked very much "not ready" and that likely also informs that thing I was worried about this whole time: he's only getting 12:54 a night, and in that time he's getting drilled when he's pinned into his own zone.

It's kind of amazing that's even happening, to be honest, because also in those first three games, he's starting just 27.8 percent of his shifts back there. The rest are in the neutral or offensive zones, and that's the kind of thing that should be far more conducive to a better corsi rating against the kind of soft competition he's facing (15th in QOC on the team, ahead of only Chris Butler, Lance Bouma, Shane O'Brien, and Brian McGrattan).

You gotta send him back to junior. He has a lot of work to do and this isn't the place to do it.

4. Glencross to Philly?

When teams are rebuilding it's of course logical that they would be the ones most often connected with trade rumors originating in some of the league's bigger markets. And given the ways in which the Flyers are especially connected with such rumors more than any team save for Toronto, it was logical that connective lines between Calgary and Philadelphia would arise.

However, the idea of Curtis Glencross going to Philadelphia, which has certainly cropped up in the past few days, is one that doesn't make a lot of sense. For one thing the Flyers have no cap space and one can't imagine Calgary being too eager to take on an equal amount unless they were getting something very good in return. Which I'm not so sure Philly would give up. At least, not at this juncture.

Obviously, as the trade deadline approaches teams will get more interested and come knocking, and if Philly's anywhere near the playoffs they're gonna sell every half-decent prospect to try to save Paul Holmgren's job.

Glencross could at that time be particularly attractive because he's cheap and signed for next season. Frankly, I'd be shocked if he wasn't gone at that point.

5. Here's a new and updated thing

After the Iginla picture got so many complaints the last time I used it I have since updated it and I hope you all like it and don't hate me.

686dfac3780611cb7acad6ce5166c6c1
Yer ol' buddy Lambert is handsome and great and everyone loves him. Also you can visit his regular blog at The Two-Line Pass or follow him on Twitter. Lucky you!
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#1 maimster
October 10 2013, 12:22PM
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Regarding Monahan, before everyone gets excited about his scoring and using that as justification for keeping him up, that was the same thing said about Nugent-Hopkins a couple of years ago - "he's the leading scorer on the team, of course they can't send him down, that'd be terrible". Instead, he stayed up, burned a year of the ELC (which is a big deal whether "it's not my money", smart teams always manage their budgets vis a vis the cap), got worse as the year went on, has struggled with injuries a bit, and has no impact on the team whatsoever. He should have been sent back...and so should Monahan.

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#2 MyTwoCents
October 10 2013, 11:45AM
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Dear Ryan "buzz-kill" Lambert, From this point on I will always skip your articles. Your just a sour puss at heart and reading your articles has become a chore. I usually leave feeling sad for you and your negative outlook on the Flames and probably life in general. We are in a rebuild and are winning some games and you feel the need to highlight the teams shortcomings over and over again? Is that your only job? We are all cheering for an underdog team, plenty of bad to go around but quite a few positives as well. You are definitely the worst part of favorite website. I hate you!

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#3 NHL93
October 10 2013, 09:57AM
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No. 3: Thank-you thank-you thank-you. I really want this kid to be sent down. It will not ruin his career.

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#4 KetchupKid
October 10 2013, 12:52PM
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MyTwoCents wrote:

Dear Ryan "buzz-kill" Lambert, From this point on I will always skip your articles. Your just a sour puss at heart and reading your articles has become a chore. I usually leave feeling sad for you and your negative outlook on the Flames and probably life in general. We are in a rebuild and are winning some games and you feel the need to highlight the teams shortcomings over and over again? Is that your only job? We are all cheering for an underdog team, plenty of bad to go around but quite a few positives as well. You are definitely the worst part of favorite website. I hate you!

Please reconsider and continue to not only read Lambert's articles, but comment under them as well - if only for my sake. I'm sure I'd still enjoy the "5 Things" pieces, but they just wouldn't be the same without the outraged whining of fans like you.

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#5 NHL93
October 10 2013, 12:56PM
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maimster wrote:

Regarding Monahan, before everyone gets excited about his scoring and using that as justification for keeping him up, that was the same thing said about Nugent-Hopkins a couple of years ago - "he's the leading scorer on the team, of course they can't send him down, that'd be terrible". Instead, he stayed up, burned a year of the ELC (which is a big deal whether "it's not my money", smart teams always manage their budgets vis a vis the cap), got worse as the year went on, has struggled with injuries a bit, and has no impact on the team whatsoever. He should have been sent back...and so should Monahan.

My reason for wanting him to go down is similar. He's looking fantastic now.. what about in two weeks? One month? Two months? It reminds me of Spezza years ago.. who passed the eye test every time he got called up. Yet he was always sent down. Monahan is younger. I'm sorry folks, teenagers in the NHL only apply to generational talents like Crosby/Ovie. Monahan has looked great and he puts a smile on all of our faces, but send him down after 9. PLEASE!

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#6 wot96
October 10 2013, 12:05PM
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@Christian Roatis

and unnecessarily.

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#7 TRAV
October 10 2013, 12:47PM
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@MyTwoCents

I absolutely think that you are entitled to skip over articles if they upset you or if you get nothing out of them. I always cringe when opinions resort to name calling and or personal attacks. Hate his writing, hate his perspectives, hate his negativity... but I doubt that you know much about him on a personal level to warrant hating him as a person.

It is slightly interesting too that you blast him for being so negative and then proceed to write one of the most negative posts I've seen in a while...

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#8 Tenbrucelees
October 10 2013, 09:37AM
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It is as if RL trolls the website he writes for. Weird.

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#9 Danger
October 10 2013, 09:52AM
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Re: #2 - here's a fun fact. "The last time the Flames earned at least one point in their first four games was in 2009 when they had a 4-0 start." Remind me again how that season turned out?

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#10 icedawg_42
October 10 2013, 10:00AM
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Just to add a couple things -

#5 LOVE the picture. Good 'un

Re: sending Monahan to junior: whatever his 'advanced numbers' say - I'm a proponent of keeping him up. I think he's earned it. I don't think there's any value in sending him down - there's nothing left for him to learn in Junior, and since minor pro is not an option, let him swim with the big fish, and lastly it sends the proper message that this team will award performance and effort appropriately - the "dont burn a year of his elc" argument to me holds no water. It ain't our money - if in 3 years he's worth a big payday, we'll know it.

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#11 Willi P
October 10 2013, 10:03PM
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Typical sensationalist article by Lambert; only writing to get a reaction from the fan base in Calgary (even though he lives many thousands of K from here) while very, very rarely taking to time to respond or defend the comments opposed to his opinions. Perfect example in his round table comments, his opinion was that the Flames will get 55-60 points this year. This total would be worse than any of the Oilers teams that drafted 1st overall, any of the three times; in fact, worse than any team since Philly in 2005-06. Does he really believe that? Doubt it. Call him on it, not response. RL spews negative crap from all holes and doesn’t have the balls to defend the retorts. Writes for reaction, not content; no longer interested. Rant over.

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#12 loudogYYC
October 10 2013, 10:39PM
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@Willi P

I don't see the purpose of writing an article on this hockey blog if it's not going to cause a reaction. Every writer here has a brand and a style and that's a big part of what makes FN great. I don't always agree with what I read in Lamberts articles, or on anyone else's for that matter, but that's no reason to let the hate get out of hand.

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#13 RustyStrombone
October 10 2013, 10:10AM
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Lambert, you continue to use ridiculous claims to back up your stance. Sure I agree that expectatons need to be tempered, and that we are in no way a playoff team. However you seem to be grasping at straws to point out how "bad" the Flames are. The evidence is there, but instead you pick and choose little bits of information to try to back up your points.

"even if they're scoring a lot it's because they're shooting 11.4 percent (before the game last night). Meanwhile, they're only stopping 87.9 percent of shots."

We have a PDO below 100 however you still use this to back up the claim that this hockey is unsustainable.

While you may generally have a good point, it is almost always presented poorly and in a tone that makes it hard to agree with you. It makes your aritcles difficult to read, however it usually makes for an entertaining comments section.

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#14 lionlager
October 10 2013, 11:11AM
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Garbage. If you're disheartened that the flames are getting points and looking good then throw on an Oilers jersey and move there. There you can cheer for losses with abandon. Enjoy.

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#15 icedawg_42
October 10 2013, 11:23AM
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schevvy wrote:

Where's Jarome?!?!???

In other news, unless Monahan doesn't score in the next 5 games I have a hard time believing they'll send him down. He's the leading scorer on the team, I believe he's had a positive chance differential the past two games, and just seems to be fitting in. He obviously won't score at a rate of 5 points in 4 games all season but the line of him-Stemps-Sven is really clicking. I'm not against sending him back to junior but I don't think that's happening.

Also I've really been impressed with the play of Sven, especially last night. Looks like Burke calling him out has woken him up. Helps of course to be playing with the best forward on the team in Stempniak.

yeah, but the whole point is...."TEH"!

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#16 Christian Roatis
October 10 2013, 11:49AM
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MyTwoCents wrote:

Dear Ryan "buzz-kill" Lambert, From this point on I will always skip your articles. Your just a sour puss at heart and reading your articles has become a chore. I usually leave feeling sad for you and your negative outlook on the Flames and probably life in general. We are in a rebuild and are winning some games and you feel the need to highlight the teams shortcomings over and over again? Is that your only job? We are all cheering for an underdog team, plenty of bad to go around but quite a few positives as well. You are definitely the worst part of favorite website. I hate you!

Well that escalated quickly.

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#17 Willi P
October 11 2013, 06:58AM
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@loudogYYC

I don't see the purpose of writing an article on this hockey blog only to cause a reaction. Most of RL's content is antagonistic and reminds me of the "Equirer" tabloid style. I don't have an issue or have to agree with any writer all of the time providing they appear (or attempt)to back up their argument. Writing for reaction factor only, like the 55-60 point example, is boring and juvenile. No hate here, will simply stop reading his crap.

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#18 mk
October 10 2013, 09:46AM
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That picture is excellent in so many ways...

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#19 Danger
October 10 2013, 09:48AM
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#5: Perfect. I love it.

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#20 TRAV
October 10 2013, 10:11AM
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I actually quite enjoy the five things from RL because they always have different perspectives than mine and they tend to make me think. It's easy to find plenty of glowing Flames praise from the regular media outlets and these articles are always...well...different.

I think that Kent and RL are partially correct when they suggest that people would be, "pulling their hair out over these losses." In a previous post someone far smarter than I countered that this wasn't entirely fair. Their perspective was that if Fans had seen a work ethic and compete level like this year that they would be far more forgiving. Too often in the past blown leads seemed to come from a lack of caring. It is far easier to deal with frustrating losses when you can see guys working hard and genuinely "pissed off" after giving up a point.

I am not sure that I agree with Lambert about Monahan. Correct me if I am wrong, (and I may be), but I thought that generally writer's on this site didn't put too much stock in plus minus. Having said that Lambert did support his point with other supporting info. For me it comes down to where will Monahan develop the best. It seems to me that he is learning and improving each game in the NHL. The bottom line is does he benefit more from playing 14ish minutes a night against the best in the world or 20 something minutes a night against far weaker competition? At this point it seems to me that he is contributing and holding his own against the world's best. I don't think that his confidence is deteriorating nor do I think that he isn't able to make creative plays. (as witnessed by last night's passes) Finally I guess as a guy that spends lots of money on tickets he is fun to watch and gives me something to look forward to on my way to the rink. I'd feel pretty upset if they sent him down to save money at the end of this contract. (especially if they deem him ready now)

Firmly agree that this is unlikely to continue but for the meantime it sure is fun to watch!!!

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#21 T&A4Flames
October 10 2013, 10:44AM
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@TRAV

If they send him down it won't be to save a few bucks down the road. Offensively he's looked great D needs work. Even his F/O haven't been that good and its something he prides himself in. Whatever the Flames brass decides to do, ill trust that its the right thing to do.

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#22 SeanCharles
October 10 2013, 01:07PM
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I usually forget to see who the author of an article is until the end.

But after reading a little bit I can always pick out Lambert's....

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#23 Avalain
October 10 2013, 01:38PM
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NHL.com has Monahan at -1 right now, which is really not that bad. I was always in the camp of "keep him if he does ok" and I really think he has been ok.

My biggest issue is that I simply do not think that the CHL is the place where he can work to improve his defensive abilities or his faceoffs. I mean, we've all read about how focused he's been on winning faceoffs as a kid. Beating 16 year olds on the dot won't help him improve in the NHL.

IMO, it isn't in his best interest to make him learn defense against adults in the NHL by putting him against children in the CHL. As Ryan says, "he has a lot of work to do and this isn't the place to do it.". Unfortunately, the place to do it is the AHL and he's not allowed to play there. From what I can see, the worst that happens if Monahan plays in the NHL is that we lose more games. I'd say that doesn't sound so bad to most Flames fans right now.

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#24 negrilcowboy
October 10 2013, 04:53PM
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At this stage the Flames have to keep Monzie. if they send him back to the 67s it may be a blow to his pyschy, leading the team in scoring and such. The ohl offers him little, besides he would have to be traded to the powerhouse London Knights, the Mem Cup hosts as Dave Branch seems to turn a blind eye to the Knights bankrolling ala the Yankees.

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#25 Burnward
October 10 2013, 05:53PM
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@MyTwoCents

It's okay.

Hits = Self worth.

Don't you know that by now?

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#26 SVENSANITY
October 10 2013, 05:54PM
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"he's also been on the ice for seven goals against, including four in the Canucks game alone."

This statement would be fair if he and he alone was the defensive liability. The thing about any stat is that it only tells you one part of the whole picture. You actually have to watch the games, Ryan, to make observations from the stats.

If you watched the same games i did, Ryan, you would have specifically noticed that Sean was a victim of circumstance in 2 of the 3 GA during the Vancouver game. He was only responsible personally for 1 GA in which he got hemmed in below the goal line and lost a battle for the puck. A mistake i might add all of our team has made at one point or another.

He is a victim of circumstance in the fact that the whole team is bad defensively and the whole team is making stupid errors in the defensive zone. It would be unwise to judge his fate based on defensive stats alone as they are not representative of the whole picture and therefore it's erroneous to make the decision based on them without actual analysis of the experimental conditions.

for example one does not just run an experiment, record the stats, do an anova, or t-test, or Chi squared analysis and then make final conclusions based on the stats alone. There's a level of interpretation that goes along with the stats. It's called the discussion and it's where you apply theory and though to the actual statistics. You often tend to miss this part drawing conclusions from numbers alone without any context.

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#27 the-wolf
October 11 2013, 08:04AM
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TRAV wrote:

I actually quite enjoy the five things from RL because they always have different perspectives than mine and they tend to make me think. It's easy to find plenty of glowing Flames praise from the regular media outlets and these articles are always...well...different.

I think that Kent and RL are partially correct when they suggest that people would be, "pulling their hair out over these losses." In a previous post someone far smarter than I countered that this wasn't entirely fair. Their perspective was that if Fans had seen a work ethic and compete level like this year that they would be far more forgiving. Too often in the past blown leads seemed to come from a lack of caring. It is far easier to deal with frustrating losses when you can see guys working hard and genuinely "pissed off" after giving up a point.

I am not sure that I agree with Lambert about Monahan. Correct me if I am wrong, (and I may be), but I thought that generally writer's on this site didn't put too much stock in plus minus. Having said that Lambert did support his point with other supporting info. For me it comes down to where will Monahan develop the best. It seems to me that he is learning and improving each game in the NHL. The bottom line is does he benefit more from playing 14ish minutes a night against the best in the world or 20 something minutes a night against far weaker competition? At this point it seems to me that he is contributing and holding his own against the world's best. I don't think that his confidence is deteriorating nor do I think that he isn't able to make creative plays. (as witnessed by last night's passes) Finally I guess as a guy that spends lots of money on tickets he is fun to watch and gives me something to look forward to on my way to the rink. I'd feel pretty upset if they sent him down to save money at the end of this contract. (especially if they deem him ready now)

Firmly agree that this is unlikely to continue but for the meantime it sure is fun to watch!!!

Nice post.

I've always agreed with this part, "For me it comes down to where will Monahan develop the best," but feel like my standard of what should keep him up is higher than what some others on here think.

I just posted on the last article that Monahan is making me come around to keeping him up. I was one of his biggest bosoters at draf time, but I reallt didn't think he'd be this good, this soon.

Now, Lambert's article is making me re-think even more. I hate to be a fence sitter, but it's a tough one. He really has impressed and I totally get your argument. But is he holding his own with being sheltered, etc.? Is it enough ice time? I honestly don't know. Like I said, he's better than I thought, sooner than I thought.

I guess we'll have a little bit better idea after 9 games. Playing a ton in all situations and being 'the man' is ceratinly not a bad way to develop.

Maybe I just prefer to err on the side of caution. I still think he wouldn't be hurt by being sent down. On the other hand, if he continues to improve over the next 5 games it gets even tougher.

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#28 the-wolf
October 11 2013, 08:08AM
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loudogYYC wrote:

I don't see the purpose of writing an article on this hockey blog if it's not going to cause a reaction. Every writer here has a brand and a style and that's a big part of what makes FN great. I don't always agree with what I read in Lamberts articles, or on anyone else's for that matter, but that's no reason to let the hate get out of hand.

Agreed. I cheer for the Flames to win the ultimate goal, but I can't stand sites like FN where the whole idea is to simply cheer blindly about everything, good, bad or ugly.

Besides, positivity doesn't create interesting discussion. There's only so many "go team" comments one can read. Of course, you can say the same thing about blind negativity, "they suck" gets pretty old too.

But critical thought, done appropriately, is what make discussion interesting. If you really can't stomach it, don't read it. Just like I don't read the drivel on FN.

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#29 BJ
October 11 2013, 08:28AM
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@Willi P

agree... while Lamberts style can be entertaining at times I would also go so far as to call it reactionary and not well thought out.

Monahan played over fifteen minutes last night. Maybe the coaching staff kept him limited in his first couple of games as it was hist first taste of pro hockey. Seems reasonable to me. Seems like his ice time is on the rise so I would just ignore Lamberts bit on Monahan here. (I am not saying we shouldnt send him down)

Remember Lambert blew up after Feaster drafted Monahan over Nichushkin.... very reactionary... how can we judge these moves by Calgary in such a reactionary manner.

Also Lambert instantly bashed the Jones Tanguay trade.

Jones has been playing great and is making some of the writers on this site look very foolish and reactionary indeed.

I can spew reactionary opinions... anyone can... I read FN for insight and entertainment these reactionary articles cause us toplug our noses turn away for a moment.

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#30 BJ
October 11 2013, 08:40AM
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Lambert has always been biased against Feaster so dont be surprised at articles like this.

If you want perspective on the Flames I encourage fans to engage in discussions with intellevent of other teams than the Flames r the iolers... fans who have no interest in bias either way.

If you look around the web you will find quite a positive view of Feaster and company... Fansa formteams like SJ and Philly for example are very impressed with calgarys turn around from an old lacklustre team to a young one that works very hard.

Again dont get worked up over Lamberts articles... he has always been against Feaster... I would even say fanatically so... hence all the reactionary poorly thought out opinions...

Lamberts style is quite different from other FN writers in that in lieu of analysis we get almost a religious reaction...

it is his style... view it as entertainment not good hockey analysis

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#31 icedawg_42
October 10 2013, 09:53AM
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Tenbrucelees wrote:

It is as if RL trolls the website he writes for. Weird.

This article comes across as pretty gloomy/negative, but I agree with the sentiment that people need to temper their expectations. I'm sure management is looking at Monahan's whole 200ft game and not just the points he's putting up. I was at the dome for the Vancouver game, and I can say that he's a special player for sure..but however mature they say he is physically, he needs to work on his foot speed a bit.

I know the numbers will regress - both for and against, but after watching their transition game, there's a lot to be excited about - if they can shore up the gaffs in the defensive zone that is - but this is NOT a veteran team..They clearly don't know how to handle the "push" - that will improve over time.

I wholehartedly disagree with anyone who says this team is bereft of talent and is just flat out "no good" - that's flat out wrong.

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#32 vowswithin
October 10 2013, 10:02AM
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I am starting to get excited about having someone young that Sven can start building with! I was concerned for awhile with the lack of center options but between Monahan and Back he should be good.

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#33 T&A4Flames
October 10 2013, 10:21AM
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At least add a picture to the "cheer up" where someone is smiling. Whether its Sven or Monahan add a smile. :)

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#34 KetchupKid
October 10 2013, 10:28AM
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@T&A4Flames

Jay has two smiles - that should count for something.

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#35 piscera.infada
October 10 2013, 11:10AM
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For me, in regards to Monahan, I was always in the camp of send him back. However, I justified it in a different way then Lambert. I felt that if his offensive game didn't translate, sending him down would be best so he doesn't stagnate offensively. I feel like Monahan has shown that he can contribute with regularity offensively (at least to this point), and if that doesn't change he should stay.

To me the defensive part of his game is only going to get better in the NHL. I wouldn't say he's been horrible either - I've seen some great defensive plays out of him. It just seems to me that if Monahan can work on his defensive game against men instead of 16 to 19 year olds, he'll only get better at it. Additionally, the OHL and the QMJHL aren't necessarily beacons of great defensive play or zone coverage - it always takes players coming out of those leagues time to adjust defensively.

I guess the point I'm trying to get at is that if it's defensive coverage and speed that's holding him back yet he is still consistently contributing offensively, I don't see why you wouldn't want to have him acclimate those aspects of his game to the competition you hope he'll play against for the next 15 to 20 years, instead of against inferior competition. From what we've seen from him so far and what we heard about him before/after the draft, we know he's an extremely smart, adaptive hockey player. With that in mind, I don't think learning to be better defensively in the NHL is going to hurt him either.

@T&A4Flames

In the same vein, faceoffs are something the vast majority of young hockey players have issues with when they make the jump to the NHL. Actually, when they make the jump in skill more broadly - whether it's peewee to bantam, midget to junior, or into the NHL. It's a very skilled aspect of the game - usually replete with small tricks - and strength is a massive advantage. I wouldn't read too much into it.

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#36 schevvy
October 10 2013, 11:15AM
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Where's Jarome?!?!???

In other news, unless Monahan doesn't score in the next 5 games I have a hard time believing they'll send him down. He's the leading scorer on the team, I believe he's had a positive chance differential the past two games, and just seems to be fitting in. He obviously won't score at a rate of 5 points in 4 games all season but the line of him-Stemps-Sven is really clicking. I'm not against sending him back to junior but I don't think that's happening.

Also I've really been impressed with the play of Sven, especially last night. Looks like Burke calling him out has woken him up. Helps of course to be playing with the best forward on the team in Stempniak.

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#37 schevvy
October 10 2013, 11:26AM
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icedawg_42 wrote:

yeah, but the whole point is...."TEH"!

Well that's just too obvious

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#38 Baalzamon
October 10 2013, 11:36AM
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@piscera.infada

re: faceoffs, MacKinnon is currently at 18%. That is just mindblowingly bad.

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#39 Parallex
October 10 2013, 11:36AM
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schevvy wrote:

Where's Jarome?!?!???

In other news, unless Monahan doesn't score in the next 5 games I have a hard time believing they'll send him down. He's the leading scorer on the team, I believe he's had a positive chance differential the past two games, and just seems to be fitting in. He obviously won't score at a rate of 5 points in 4 games all season but the line of him-Stemps-Sven is really clicking. I'm not against sending him back to junior but I don't think that's happening.

Also I've really been impressed with the play of Sven, especially last night. Looks like Burke calling him out has woken him up. Helps of course to be playing with the best forward on the team in Stempniak.

Wonder if over the next 5 they'll give him some tougher assignments. I mean if the idea is to give him 9 games to demonstrate that he can hang with men this season then maybe for the last 5 take off the kid gloves?

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#40 icedawg_42
October 10 2013, 11:38AM
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@Parallex

Not a bad idea

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#41 Baalzamon
October 10 2013, 11:39AM
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In other news, the Flames just recalled Blair Jones. To replace David Jones (injured).

D.Jones is out week to week. That was a nasty fall he took last night.

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#42 MichaelD
October 10 2013, 11:47AM
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@piscera.infada

I totally agree. I think his defensive game will best be developed against NHL competition.

Same with Faceoffs, I remember him saying in a interview he started watching tape on NHL Faceoffs right after he was drafted. So if this year is all about development then throw Monahan in the circle with Bergeron when we play the bruins and let him try what he sees on tape on the ice against the actual competition.

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#43 Parallex
October 10 2013, 11:51AM
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Baalzamon wrote:

In other news, the Flames just recalled Blair Jones. To replace David Jones (injured).

D.Jones is out week to week. That was a nasty fall he took last night.

Must have been if they skipped past day-to-day and went straight to week-to-week. Slipped disk in his back? Can't just be spasms.

Kinda surprised that it's the other Jones getting the call... so B. Jones for 4th line C and either Street or Colborne moves to the wing?

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#44 kittensandcookies
October 10 2013, 11:53AM
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GlenX will stay here forever if the Flames want him. He's loved where he lives and even runs a freakin' rodeo.

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#45 maimter
October 10 2013, 12:25PM
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maimster wrote:

Regarding Monahan, before everyone gets excited about his scoring and using that as justification for keeping him up, that was the same thing said about Nugent-Hopkins a couple of years ago - "he's the leading scorer on the team, of course they can't send him down, that'd be terrible". Instead, he stayed up, burned a year of the ELC (which is a big deal whether "it's not my money", smart teams always manage their budgets vis a vis the cap), got worse as the year went on, has struggled with injuries a bit, and has no impact on the team whatsoever. He should have been sent back...and so should Monahan.

..."had" no impact on team, sorry...don't want all those Oiler fans yelling at me. And to stop another comment, I meant had no impact on the team being any better than putrid, in his rookie year (or last year, for that matter!)

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#46 piscera.infada
October 10 2013, 01:07PM
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@maimster

@NHL93

They aren't the same player, so I'm not sure they're directly comparable. There's always going to be anecdotal evidence to support sending him down, but at the same time I'm sure I could rifle up some anecdotal evidence to support keeping him.

I said before, I was firmly in the "send him down" camp at the beginning of the season - but now I just don't think it's as cut and dry as we might want to make it seem. It all boils down to feel from the coaches and management (the people that are around him every day, evaluate him every day, and get to see the work and effort he puts in off the ice every day). So I guess I have to defer to management - if that's difficult for you, then that's too bad. I just don't think it's as easy as saying "regardless of anything, he should be sent down because he's 'x' age, or similar to 'x' player".

I don't think sending him down will hurt him - but after seeing his play and attitude first hand, I'm starting to believe that keeping him up wont hurt him either. That is, of course, barring a bad injury - which could just as easily happen in Junior as well. Either way, this kid has a very bright future, and he made me get over Barkov/Lindholm very quickly - not because I think he's better per se, but because I really like his style of play.

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#47 icedawg_42
October 10 2013, 01:24PM
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"Nuge" and Monahan play totally different games, PLUS Nuge weighs about 30lbs. In fact both Nuge and Hall play the type of game that makes them very prone to injury. Monahan does not play like that - nor is he build like a bird. You'll have a tough time convincing me they are on the same track. You'll have an even tougher time convincing me that using a year of his ELC (if he turns out to be ready) is "bad" for business. Calgary sits 29th overall in cap hit. SMART management is about putting the proper SECONDARY pieces around our stars when they're ready to get paid (and contend.)

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#48 Aussie Flame
October 10 2013, 01:25PM
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Shocked if GlenX isn't gone, really? Between his NTC and immersion in all things Alberta, I don't see him leaving too soon. I would be more "shocked" if he left.

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#49 McRib
October 10 2013, 01:26PM
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@piscera.infada

"Additionally, the OHL and the QMJHL aren't necessarily beacons of great defensive play or zone coverage - it always takes players coming out of those leagues time to adjust defensively."

Best point anyone has made on this post!! Why in the world would we send Sean Monahan down to work on his defensive game?!?!?! Major Junior is a run and gun mistake driven league where awful defensive decisions drive the play and decent players get away with far too much.

If he wasn't scoring every game I could understand sending him down to gain confidence offensively, but I'll remind people again Monahan had 1.35 PPG on the worst team in the OHL. If he was on a better team with even one player remotely capable of keeping up with him (Dante Salituro was second in scoring on Ottawa last year, a 16 year old 5'8" rookie that finished 38 points behind him) he would have led the OHL in scoring last year (i.e. never made it to us with the 6th pick).

Anyway regardless we need to teach a rookie how to play defense and want to finish as low as possible... Why would we send him down to junior again. It's the perfect opportunity where we can afford a player with a mediocre +/- that is ready to produce.

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#50 piscera.infada
October 10 2013, 01:31PM
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@Aussie Flame

I agree completely with this. While he's probably our best asset (with the possible exception of Cammy), the guy took a hometown discount to stay here just so he could get the NTC. He won't leave unless he wants out - and that all depends on the signs of life this team shows this season.

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