Post-Game: Dark Night

Justin Azevedo
October 24 2013 09:26PM

 


 

A disastrous stretch during the second period sunk the Flames tonight as they failed to finish the first major road trip of the season on a positive note. The 5-1 score wasn't necessarily indicative of the game as a whole, as for the first 30 and last 10 or so minutes they kept up with the Stars. However, the result is the result and Calgary falls to .500 for the first time this season.

The Rundown

The period started off with a big chance from Jamie Benn right off the hop but a bunch of back and forth play resulted in a pretty tepid few minutes until Kris Russell completely abandoned his position to chase Cody Eakin (super underrated, by the way) and as a result allowed a wide-open Alex Chiasson to pot his 4th of the year past Karri Rämö. Really nice play from Eakin to draw Russell away but that's still not a move a supposed top-4 NHL defenseman should be making. I thought TJ Galliardi had a really nice period - he had two of the Flames' three chances in the period and drew a penalty on Kevin Connatton. Shots were 10-8 for the Flames (9-8 at EV) and chances were 3-3, all at even strength.

The second period picked up a considerable amount, though, as the Stars would put the pressure on around the 15 minute mark forcing Rämö to make a nice pad stop before the play turned the other way and a good rush from Lee Stempniak resulted in his 4th of the season. Legit snipe, too - it was a nicely placed shot just over the right shoulder of Lehtonen. From there, though, the wheels kinda fell off. In just over a minute, Rämö allowed 3 goals of varying quality. The goal that made it 2-1 came off of Alex Chiasson's stick as a result of a garbage giveaway from Chris Breen. The goal that made it 3-1 was a pretty well-placed shot from Jamie Benn but the Stars' fourth goal was pretty weak - Brendan Dillon scored his third of the year with a floater from the point immediately after a faceoff. The Flames reigned it in a little towards the end of the period but the damage was done. Chances were 9-4 for Dallas, all at even strength. Shots were 15-9 for Dallas, all at evens.

One more goal by Jamie Benn on a wraparound was basically the nail in the coffin about three and a half minutes into the period. Another situation where Kris Russell completely lost his man and as a result the puck ended up in the back of the net. A couple of good 5-on-3 kills were basically the sole positive from the period. Chances were 7-2 for the Stars in the frame, 4-1 at even strength. Shots were 11-10 for the Stars in the third, but 8-6 at even strength for the Flames.

Why The Flames Lost

Simply, they had a few breakdowns in the 2nd period and paid dearly for it. There were systematic breakdowns at every position on every goal. They didn't possess the puck enough and looked pretty listless overall.

Red Warrior

No one really stood out tonight, but Lee Stempniak scored his 4th of the season, so let's give it to him. He's had a pretty good season so far and might actually fetch the Flames a first rounder in March - so that's nice.

Scoring Chances

# Player EV     PP     SH    
4 RUSSELL, KRIS 18:59 2 6 02:28 0 0 02:13 0 2
6 WIDEMAN, DENNIS 19:30 2 7 02:35 0 0 02:19 1 2
7 BRODIE, TJ 18:01 4 5 01:05 0 0 03:15 0 1
8 COLBORNE, JOE 08:23 0 1 01:44 0 0 00:17 0 0
11 BACKLUND, MIKAEL 13:25 3 3 00:00 0 0 02:14 1 0
13 CAMMALLERI, MIKE 14:43 2 4 02:16 0 0 00:00 0 0
15 JACKMAN, TIM 07:37 1 1 00:00 0 0 00:34 1 0
17 BOUMA, LANCE 07:23 0 1 00:00 0 0 01:30 0 0
18 STAJAN, MATT 15:07 2 9 00:00 0 0 01:45 0 2
20 GLENCROSS, CURTIS 15:56 2 10 02:07 0 0 00:18 0 0
22 STEMPNIAK, LEE 14:39 2 8 01:53 0 0 00:25 0 0
23 MONAHAN, SEAN 12:43 3 2 01:43 0 0 00:25 0 0
24 HUDLER, JIRI 14:04 2 3 02:16 0 0 00:00 0 0
31 RAMO, KARRI   8 16   0 0   1 3
39 GALIARDI, TJ 13:45 4 2 00:00 0 0 00:56 0 1
43 BREEN, CHRISTOPHER 11:31 2 4 00:00 0 0 00:35 0 0
44 BUTLER, CHRIS 18:32 4 5 00:00 0 0 02:46 1 1
54 JONES, DAVID 13:54 3 4 01:53 0 0 00:18 0 0
55 O'BRIEN, SHANE 14:26 2 5 00:00 0 0 00:00 0

0

 

Team Period Time Note Home Away State
Home 1 19:23 Benn 3 4 14 17 32 91 7 18 20 22 31 44 5v5
Home 1 15:57 Chiasson (Goal) 12 13 20 23 32 55 4 6 11 31 39 54 5v5
Home 1 13:17 Peverley 14 17 23 32 55 91 4 6 18 20 22 31 5v5
Away 1 13:02 Galliardi 12 14 23 32 55 91 4 6 11 31 39 54 5v5
Away 1 8:50 Monahan 6 21 24 28 32 38 7 20 22 23 31 44 5v5
Away 1 3:54 Galliardi 14 17 23 32 55 91 7 11 31 39 44 54 5v5
Home 2 19:42 Peverley 3 4 14 17 32 91 7 18 20 22 31 44 5v5
Home 2 15:42 Benn 6 12 13 20 24 32 4 6 18 20 22 31 5v5
Away 2 15:31 Stempniak (Goal) 6 12 13 20 24 32 4 6 18 20 22 31 5v5
Home 2 15:20 Nichushkin 3 4 10 32 43 72 7 13 23 24 31 44 5v5
Home 2 14:27 Roussell 21 23 28 32 38 55 13 23 31 43 54 55 5v5
Home 2 12:54 Chiasson 12 13 20 23 32 55 4 6 11 31 39 54 5v5
Home 2 10:35 Horcoff 3 4 10 32 43 72 18 20 22 31 43 55 5v5
Home 2 10:29 Nichushkin 6 10 24 32 43 72 18 20 22 31 43 55 5v5
Home 2 8:49 Chiasson (Goal) 3 4 14 17 32 91 7 18 20 22 31 44 5v5
Home 2 8:31 Benn (Goal) 14 17 23 32 55 91 4 6 8 15 17 31 5v5
Home 3 16:25 Benn (Goal) 4 12 14 20 23 32 4 6 18 20 24 31 5v5
Home 3 14:41 Cole 3 4 32 38 43 72 6 11 13 24 31 55 5v5
Home 3 10:26 MacDermid 10 23 32 43 55 72 7 18 20 22 31 44 5v5
Home 3 7:09 Benn 3 12 13 14 32 91 7 31 39 44     5v3
Home 3 3:39 Chiasson 14 17 20 32 55 91 4 6 18 31     5v3
Home 3 3:09 Seguin 14 17 20 32 55 91 4 6 18 31     5v3
Home 3 1:58 Horcoff 4 6 10 32 43 72 13 20 31 43 54 55 5v5

 

Period Totals EV PP 5v3 PP SH 5v3 SH
1 3 3 3 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
2 4 9 4 9 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
3 2 7 1 4 0 0 0 3 1 0 0 0

Sum It Up

Sven Baertschi obviously wouldn't have turned the tide of this game by himself, but it's even more disappointing to have him sit in the press box having to watch that.

The numbers are a little skewed due to the 3 or so minutes of 5-on-3 at the end of the third but it's not like this was a game the Flames deserved to win.

In terms of the goalies, Rämö is still by far the superiour goaltender (.915 EVSV to MacDonald's .899) even though Rämö allowed 5 goals at even strength tonight. He did, however, have a very nice sequence at the end of the 3rd while killing off a couple 5-on-3s.

I don't think I've ever watched a game between the Flames and Stars (or Blue Jackets or Coyotes) and been entertained. Anyway, the Flames play next on Saturday when Washington comes to the 'Dome to play on HNIC.

A9d138d0e612f28cd46f9b7057ed715d
Justin is a 22-year-old Flames fan who also happens to be pursuing a double major at the University of Calgary. He has played hockey at high levels, enjoys wearing shorts and tends to drink far too much Grasshopper. Please don't hate him.
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#1 SoCalFlamesFan
October 25 2013, 07:34AM
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Yuk, that got bad fast. It did seem the game was closer than the score. Ramo too while a couple goals (out of position) or losing sight of the puck were weak, did a decent job. The blame I have is for the defensive breakdowns. If these guys learn from these failures great, otherwise dump them, Baertschi included. You can't win a championship with uni-dimensional players.

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#2 SmellOfVictory
October 24 2013, 09:48PM
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HAHA GLENCROSS YOU CRAPBAG. Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwful.

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#3 Mort
October 24 2013, 10:01PM
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I'm not totally sure of Ramo as a goalie, but I'm sure of JoeyMac (and it's obviously not favourable). Hartley's gotta stay with Ramo as the numero uno for awhile yet... Right?

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#4 the forgotten man
October 25 2013, 12:39PM
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Kevin R wrote:

Yeah, I agree, we are going to have nights like this. We cant expect the young team to play at the pace they have been & every team craps the bed on given nights. I am glad Sven cant be blamed for this stinker & sent back to Abby. We get all our vets back & bam we have a night like tonight. You know what, I've seen enough of some of these vets for many losing years. I'd like to see some different players now, so I would like to see some of these vets moved for a top 4 dman because damn, that defence is scary looking. Quite frankly, Id rather watch Tspoon & Ramage slot in rather than Russell & Butler. How much worse can it be?

I vote Kevin R to replace "The Feast"...measured comments and insights 9 times out of 10.

GlenX - obviously doesn't want to be here any longer - GONE

Stajan - beyond tired of watching his play - GONE

Cammalleri - been injured...hopefully puts up points and trade him at deadline - EVENTUALLY GONE

Jackman - no comment necessary - GONE

All the above are dead-weight as the Club moves forward...I too am tired of watching these guys.

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#5 Primo
October 25 2013, 04:31PM
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Hartley is starting to show his true colours for his desire to play veterans. That may be good for his own job security but not sure that is best for the team long term strategy of rebuild and development of the young talent. With Burke on board not surprising that this shift is taking place. At the end of this day I revert to these 2 guys who have won Stanley Cups and I believe are qualified to steer this ship.

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#6 calgaryfan
October 25 2013, 05:03PM
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@piscera.infada

I never said GREAT NHL TEAM those are your words. What is Glencross teaching the young guys, take as many games off as you like its ok. I have had enough of the old guard and their attitude. It is time for some enthusiasm and energy. I have seen enough of Stajan to know he is not a winner, gives up way too easily on pucks. Also not a good example for the new guys. There are enough vets without these two.

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#7 Package Pete
October 25 2013, 09:20PM
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Is Hartley East Indian?

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#8 Derzie
October 25 2013, 09:01AM
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Hey, I know. Let's sit a member of our top producing line, destroy the line chemistry and see if the players side with the coach. Sure looks like like this result is ALL on Hartley. I'm not talking about winning, that's a nice-to-have. I'm talking about effort. The team didn't play. Is Hartley losing the team already with his dumb moves? Sven is Blair Jones part deux and makes even less sense. I personally was hoping for a beatdown I was so upset by the Sven snub. His biggest problem is confidence, not effort. Grrrrr. Hartley, you spoiled the parade. We had a good thing going and you burst the bubble. Hopefully we can get it back soon. Oh and if this is meddling by Burke, pitchfork and torch time.

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#9 Jeff In Lethbridge
October 25 2013, 09:20AM
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It's a rebuilding year, so logically, we will:

A) bench the young prospects if their game isn't perfect, and

B) Play the veterans repeatedly, even when they play like crap, so they can "play through it".

I guess the upside - if Hartley benches the rookies, is that he won't need to dress the dancing bear to protect them.

PS: Harltey's man-crush on McGratts is embarrassing.

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#10 cunning_linguist
October 25 2013, 11:51AM
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The whole point of this year was to assess and develop our young guys. The Flames need to stop wasting valuable games on useless plugs like Butler, Jackman, McGrattan (even though he’s a super cool dude). Get rid of Butler, bring up T-Spoon Sieloff or Ramage. Get rid of Jackman, let Baertschi play. Trade Stajan at the deadline for a 2nd rounder so that a Horak or a Corban Knight or even a Josh Jooris can come in. Trade Cammy at the deadline for a 1st rounder so that there’s room for Gaudreau this March when the college season is over, maybe that will convince him to sign with us. Trade Hudler because he’s putting together a career-best season. You probably won’t get any more value for him than you would right now and he won’t be in his prime anyways once we’re ready to compete again.

The Flames need to stop making roster decisions as if we’re chasing the playoffs. Do the best you can to win with the lineup you have, but make sure that lineup is built so that you are developing and assessing young players, eliminating unknowns and investing in the future of the club.

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#11 the-wolf
October 25 2013, 05:15PM
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John wrote:

Without Giordano, it will be difficult for the flames. Defenceman with good skating skill and size don't seem to be easy to find, that is why Calgary should have taken Olli Maata, a solid draft choice for a defenceman instead of gambling on Jankowski. Maata is now starting for the Penguins, would have been terrific depth player for Calgary.

From what I hear, playing very, very well. Maybe the Flames should hire Pierre Macquire as their head of amateur scouting.

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#12 Oops
October 25 2013, 09:30PM
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Package Pete wrote:

Is Hartley East Indian?

I just googled it! He is French from Quebec with a very successful coaching record! Sorry if I offended anyone - it was not my intention Go Coach and Go Flames!

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#13 prendrefeu
October 24 2013, 10:16PM
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Sadness.

Ah well, hopefully the kids can learn a little from tonight's mistakes and pick up their game a bit.

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#14 jason knapp
October 24 2013, 10:35PM
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On a positive note Poirier scored twice tonight!

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#15 aloudoun
October 24 2013, 11:48PM
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Where did scoreface go? Urgh. Its amazing how someone can go from looking like steal on a contract to looking untradable in such a short time... Pressbox him and rip that A off his sweater. Why does this team play better when the kids are the majority? Oh because the kids care.

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#16 Jeff In Lethbridge
October 25 2013, 05:36AM
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well, we weren't going to get a high draft pick playing tbe way we did the firsr 5 games... glad to see the rebuild back on track.

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#17 ChinookArch
October 25 2013, 06:29AM
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Glencross has really been bad this year. I actually missed his play till a out the 3rd period last night. There seems to be a lot of frustration around FN with Curtis' play, but isn't it just a little early to lambaste him? He's been a warrior for to team for a long time now, he gets a pass from me for a little while longer.

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#18 McRib
October 25 2013, 09:03AM
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My biggest beef with benching of Sven Baertschi is not even the fact that on 5-on-5 he has been great and shown significant signs of improvement in the other two zones. But the main reason is why his other linemates Monahan/(Stempniak or Hudler) have higher point totals. Bob Hartley loves to yank Sven off that line (most consistent line all season) come time for a Power Play and replace him with a Glencross (not that he deserves it).

Offense is what this kid does best, so it seems truly bazaar that the Flames are keeping him off of the Power Play. If I was Bob Hartley/Brian Burke and I was adamant he had to become a complete player I would only play Sven Baertschi on the Power Play. It took Toronto three years to realize this with Nazem Kadri, now even when he is buried on the third line regular strength at least Carlyle isn’t stupid enough to forget him on the man advantage. Why do the Toronto Maple Leafs continue to win games despite advanced stats saying they are built for failure... Oh, because they have slick offensive minded young players coming off the bench and scoring on their first shot out of nowhere. Obviously Kadri needs to improve in other two zones, but he has been a real underrated offensive force for Toronto. What other players on the Calgary Flames scored 2 PPG in Junior again... Oh NO ONE!!!! To put it into presepective Jonathan Drouin was the only player in all of the CHL to break 2.0 PPG last year. To say Sven was in elite company offensively while he was in the WHL, until we destroyed his confidence would be a major understatement. Put him on the damn Power Play!!!

The major criticism I heard when Bob Hartley signed on as a coach was his inability to show patience with rookies… Seeing it loud and clear first hand now.

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#19 Jeff In Lethbridge
October 25 2013, 09:07AM
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Kent Wilson wrote:

Stajan's line got the high ground and were still ventilated. That's a bad evening.

why isn't GnenX benched... I don't get it.

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#21 SoCalFlamesFan
October 25 2013, 11:47AM
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Burnward wrote:

Dude, way too soon to be throwing Sven under the bus. I am also pretty sure he wasn't a huge reason we lost that game.

I was not throwing Sven under any bus, but if ANYONE no matter how "special" won't get the team to the next level, we should acquire those assets that will give us a least a shot. I like the play of Sven but do not consider him an integral part of the team, as this point in his development.

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#22 SmellOfVictory
October 25 2013, 12:05PM
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ChinookArch wrote:

Glencross has really been bad this year. I actually missed his play till a out the 3rd period last night. There seems to be a lot of frustration around FN with Curtis' play, but isn't it just a little early to lambaste him? He's been a warrior for to team for a long time now, he gets a pass from me for a little while longer.

Problem is that he didn't just go from a great forward to struggling. He skipped about four levels and sublimated directly to hot garbage. He has directly caused multiple goals on bad giveaways, he can't pass to save his life, he's not engaging physically, he's out of position, he's shooting from the perimeter. Even with guys like Tim Jackman and Ben Street on the team, I'd say Glencross has been, unequivocally, the worst forward on the Flames this season. That is a substantial fall from grace.

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#24 Kent Wilson
October 24 2013, 09:41PM
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Hartley puts Stajan back with Stempniak and Glencross and they get absolutely clobbered.

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#25 SmellOfVictory
October 24 2013, 09:50PM
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Put Stempniak back with Backlund, you jerk Hartley. Give Backs someone to work with other than a pair of third line players (much as I actually like Galiardi).

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#26 Burnward
October 24 2013, 10:40PM
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I'm just thankful the pants on that dude behind Hartley didn't explode.

As for the game, well at least the Oilers lost too.

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#27 schevvy
October 24 2013, 11:29PM
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Put Glencross in the press box he has been awful by all measures.

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#28 Kurt
October 25 2013, 07:25AM
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ChinookArch wrote:

Glencross has really been bad this year. I actually missed his play till a out the 3rd period last night. There seems to be a lot of frustration around FN with Curtis' play, but isn't it just a little early to lambaste him? He's been a warrior for to team for a long time now, he gets a pass from me for a little while longer.

Agree.

I think the problem is expectations. He is a great player probation every team in the NHL would want. BUT on a real cup contending team he'd be a third liner. Very valuable, offensive, two way, grit. But out lack of high end skill has unfairly put way too many expectations on him. By fans and it's probably gone to his head. I see him believing he is a top line/pp guy. Damage might be done.., once a player feels entitled and the fans turn it can be a death spiral.

I say give him some slack but I'd make it clear to other teams that we are open for business if they are interested.

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#29 Burnward
October 25 2013, 08:07AM
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@SoCalFlamesFan

Dude, way too soon to be throwing Sven under the bus. I am also pretty sure he wasn't a huge reason we lost that game.

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#30 Kent Wilson
October 25 2013, 08:43AM
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@Ryan Pike

Stajan's line got the high ground and were still ventilated. That's a bad evening.

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#31 John
October 25 2013, 01:07PM
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Without Giordano, it will be difficult for the flames. Defenceman with good skating skill and size don't seem to be easy to find, that is why Calgary should have taken Olli Maata, a solid draft choice for a defenceman instead of gambling on Jankowski. Maata is now starting for the Penguins, would have been terrific depth player for Calgary.

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#32 calgaryfan
October 25 2013, 04:28PM
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piscera.infada wrote:

While I agree with Jackman and McGrattan, you cannot just have an AHL team for a full 82 game season. That just isn't conducive to anything - regardless of what "stage" the team is at. For example, Edmonton. Checkmate.

Glencross and Stajan do not make the Flames an NHL squad. One is lazy and the other plays like a marshmellow.

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#33 the-wolf
October 25 2013, 04:55PM
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Kurt wrote:

Agree.

I think the problem is expectations. He is a great player probation every team in the NHL would want. BUT on a real cup contending team he'd be a third liner. Very valuable, offensive, two way, grit. But out lack of high end skill has unfairly put way too many expectations on him. By fans and it's probably gone to his head. I see him believing he is a top line/pp guy. Damage might be done.., once a player feels entitled and the fans turn it can be a death spiral.

I say give him some slack but I'd make it clear to other teams that we are open for business if they are interested.

I've never understood the fascination with the player. It's not a lack of skill. The guy is so fast and strong, and has such a great, powerful, accurate shot that he can release quickly and above decent hockey IQ. It's his work ethic. GelnX should be able to pot 40 a year with his physical attributes and yet when has he really ever excelled? On the 1st line? No, not ever. @nd line? Marginally, at best. When GlenX really ripped it up was as a 3rd liner, which is sad. To me, he lacks heart and if he'd agree to waive his NMC he'd be the biggest asset we could move at the deadline this season.

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#34 coachedpotatoe
October 26 2013, 09:08AM
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Lots of talk about bringing up the kids and letting them play. How many asking for this actually pay any attention to what is happening in Abby? Last night they win 4-2 and their top players are the guys we just sent down, Street, Horak and Smith. People are asking for Sieloff, Spoon and Cundari to be called up to replace Butler... none of them played last night, Sieloff is injured Cundari has not played for 3 games(injured or dog house I don't know, and Spoon healthy scratch or injured again I don't know) The two defenders other than Smith that might be close are Ramage and Billings. Are they ready for a shot?

People talking about the NCAA kids should do some homework on the NCAA schedule; our kids all play on teams hoping to make the Frozen 4 and my research says the F4 is after the Flames regular season ends. By the Jankowski scored again and Gilles won again, Johny G scored and Arnold got an assist; they tied the #1 ranked team on the road.

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#35 bookofloob
October 24 2013, 10:33PM
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http://goldandorsmith.com/GIFs/PeanutButterJellyTimeSadHartley.gif

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#36 Ryan Pike
October 24 2013, 11:01PM
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Zone starts:
-Stajan: 5 offensive, 1 defensive
-Monahan: 4 offensive, 2 defensive
-Backlund: 3 offensive, 5 defensive
-Colborne: 1 offensive, 1 defensive

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#37 aloudoun
October 24 2013, 11:50PM
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@prendrefeu

I have no problem with any of the kids play... its the supposed veterans that have been pissing me off lately. (save for Stemp, Gio and Wideman)

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#38 SmellOfVictory
October 25 2013, 12:20AM
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prendrefeu wrote:

Sadness.

Ah well, hopefully the kids can learn a little from tonight's mistakes and pick up their game a bit.

Glencross and Stajan are not kids. They are terrible, terrible adults.

#bringbackcomeau

#kidding

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#39 BJ
October 25 2013, 05:54AM
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come on now... nothing here is surprising... every year lots of young teams get off to a great start before falling off the map. Usually around the 10 or 20 games.

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#40 Lordmork
October 25 2013, 08:08AM
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Suppose Feaster could get a first-rounder for Stempniak. Do they trade him and take it? He's consistently been one of the team's better players, and while the first rounder for a "post-apex" player seems to be ideal, losing him is going to hurt in the short term, because I don't know who we have to replace him.

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#41 Jeff In Lethbridge
October 25 2013, 09:43AM
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@McRib

let's hope we are at least top 5... which seems very achievable

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#42 calgaryfan
October 25 2013, 10:37AM
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Scratch any or all of McGrattan, Glencross Jackman, Stajan, ridiculous to not have Baertchi playing. The game the flames are playing with Horak is also crazy bring him up and let him play, find out if he is an NHL player. Flames do not seem to be embracing the rebuild and youth, win a few games and back to playing all the vets who proved in the past they could not win. Too many vets take over the room and dominate. Let the youth have the room and see what happens, this is a rebuild!!

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#43 prendrefeu
October 25 2013, 11:11AM
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Can we get the dome crowd to start chanting "Let the kids play!" to convince Hartley (et al) to give the youth a bit more playing experience/time, have some fun out there and tighten up their skills for the future?

The future looks prospectively good even though the rebuild phase is a bit like those first awkward stages of puberty. But hey, let the kids play, give the vets a supporting-the-youth role, see if you can make a trade for some picks (or other) mid-season, keep the rebuild in forward motion and just have some #gritchart fun in the meantime.

"LET THE KIDS PLAY!"

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#44 piscera.infada
October 25 2013, 11:44AM
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@calgaryfan

While I agree with Jackman and McGrattan, you cannot just have an AHL team for a full 82 game season. That just isn't conducive to anything - regardless of what "stage" the team is at. For example, Edmonton. Checkmate.

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#45 vowswithin
October 25 2013, 01:05PM
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Maybe we need a Moneyball moment where we clear house on a few "favorite" players so the coach has no choice but to play the young guys.

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#46 coachedpotatoe
October 25 2013, 03:54PM
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Take a deep breath everyone, count to ten and have a reality check. Many of us got overly excited after the start the Flames had and now we want to try and fix it overnight. The rebuild is going to take 2-3 years and if everytime the Flames get beaten badly we go nuts it is going to be a long ride.

Here's what we know after 10 games and some other experience depending on the player.

In net: Joey is an adequate back up, thats it. Ramo is still an unknown and we may not geet a read on him for at least another 30 game. Berra is in the AHL to get used to NA hockey. We will find out what he is all about down the road.

On D: We know that we have 3 solid NHL caliber dmen who are probably all playing one position up in a depth chart on most teams. Gio is at best a number 2 and TJB and Wides are probably 3/4 at best. Russell is a 6 at best and is being asked to play as a 4. The other two regulars are at best replacement NHL dmen. Which begs the question what do we have on the farm? Outside of Smith we have a D group of young pros mostly first year so we should not get to high or low on them. Candari and Billings have the most AHL experience and we need to see them. OOPs I forgot Breen whom we are seeing now, lets give him 10 games to evaluate him. Of the youngsters it seems that Ramage is likely to be the most prepared so lets see him as well. Ultimately it would be benificial to let spoon and Sieloff develop most of this year in the AHL.

The forwards: Whose played well; Stemp, Hudler, Monahan and Backs.

Who have had moments of showing they can be in show; Sven, Bouma, Colborne, and TJG.

Whose been injured and should be given some slack; Cammi, DJ and Stajan.

Who have underperformed: Glencross, Jackman, and McG.

Who have played well enough in the AHL to take a look at. Hankowski leads them in goals and I think Knight and Jooris in assists. Although Byron is also up there as well. So for now we need to wait and see as none of these guys are really ready. Hopefully in another 10 games in the AHL the group will start have some seperation (Grandlund played well in 2 of his 3 games) Up front it would appear we will need to wait another year for the likes of Johny G (NCAA frozen 4 is after the end of the Flames regular season) and the other NCAA top kids and Poirier and Klimchuk too.

For now all we can hope for is that we get GIO healthy as it will allow us to better evaluate guys like Breen as 6 defensemen rather than watch Butler try and play up. Up front Glencross needs to pick up his game even if he wants out as his trade value after 10 games has fallen.

Lets not go to crazy or they will need to call the loonie bin for some of us.

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#47 the-wolf
October 25 2013, 05:06PM
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Lordmork wrote:

Suppose Feaster could get a first-rounder for Stempniak. Do they trade him and take it? He's consistently been one of the team's better players, and while the first rounder for a "post-apex" player seems to be ideal, losing him is going to hurt in the short term, because I don't know who we have to replace him.

For a first? You have to. Especially at the deadline. The future is more important than a few more wins, but I know what you're saying. I wish GlenX and Stajan would play with that much desire.

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#48 the-wolf
October 25 2013, 05:10PM
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calgaryfan wrote:

I never said GREAT NHL TEAM those are your words. What is Glencross teaching the young guys, take as many games off as you like its ok. I have had enough of the old guard and their attitude. It is time for some enthusiasm and energy. I have seen enough of Stajan to know he is not a winner, gives up way too easily on pucks. Also not a good example for the new guys. There are enough vets without these two.

I have to agree. While I totally understand and fully agree with piscera that you can't go the route of the Oilers, what's the point of vets who set poor examples?

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#49 MichaelD
October 25 2013, 05:18PM
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@the-wolf

I would disagree agree I don't think he has a 'above decent hockey IQ' at all. Glencross is a hard working guy with a hard shot and fantastic speed who can be a really great second or third line winger. But when the bounces and chances aren't going his way he sulks and thinks he's a first winger who needs a centre to feed me and generate the bounces for him.

I think just the opposite, I think he has a awful hockey IQ which is why he's a player who makes a great second or third line energy guy, but never should be reliabled upon for scoring.

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#50 clyde
October 25 2013, 09:01PM
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A little off topic but a real hot topic on this site was discussed by Bobby Orr tonight. Did anyone watch?

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