FN Weekend Open Thread - First Round Targets

Kent Wilson
May 04 2013 01:22PM

 

 

We're still working our way through the season review stuff, but that will be over shortly. Obviously the really big focus this summer will be the first round of the draft: not only do the Flames have 6th overall, but they will also have two more picks (likely in the mid-to-late '20s).

Previously we've only had to profile a handful of potential first round targets, but the pool of potential future Flames is obviously much bigger this year. As such, we need some help narrowing down the target list so we can start putting the profile series together.

Top Tier

This is the group near the top of the list. We can probably skip the top-3 (MacKinnon, Jones and Drouin) since it's unlikely they'll be in range, but the guy in the poll at right will probably all be looked at in detail: Barkov, Lindholm, Nurse, Nichushkin, Poluck, Monahan and Shinkaruk. We'll pay particular attention to the like of Lindholm and Monahan, since they are the consensus choice(s) currently. 

Others

Here's where things get messy. With the Flames secondary picks probably falling around 25 give or take a few positions, the club will have a wide spread of options, depending, of course, on how the rest of the draft proceeds.

To give you an idea of the possibilities, take a look at the recent mock draft at NHLNumbers. JT Compher and Kerby Rychel are Calgary's later picks in this hypothetical exercise, but there are many names who might be within range in June (Bo Harvat, Max Domi, Robert Hagg, Antturi Lehkonen, Alex Wennberg, Anthony Mantha, Ryan hartman, Mirco Mueller, Curtis Lazar, etc.).

We could profile guys forever, but instead we'll use your input to whittle down the skaters* to focus on. So let us know in the comments who you'd like to see FN research going forward. We'll concentrate on the players who garner the most interest.

*Goalies shouldn't be taken in the first round and will therefore be ignored.

39d8109299a9795cb3b41a4e9b49d501
Former Nations Overlord. Current FN contributor and curmudgeon For questions, complaints, criticisms, etc contact Kent @ kent.wilson@gmail. Follow him on Twitter here.
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#1 RossCreekNation
May 04 2013, 07:05PM
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Not sure why peeps wanna say away from Lazar. He's in the Mike Richards mold. Yes, please.

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#2 the forgotten man
May 04 2013, 01:51PM
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O/T...reading TSN online and laughed when I read some of their synopsis of the Penguins game last night..."Iginla had two assists last night, but was torched possession-wise". Pretty much sums up his contribution the last 3-4 years with the Flames. Pad his personal stats but an overall drag on the team...so happy he is gone, and with selling his house hopefully not coming back.

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#3 Sean Bennett
May 04 2013, 05:06PM
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I'd really like to know more about Compher, Rychel, Morin and Klimchuk please.

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#4 Jeff In Lethbridge
May 04 2013, 08:13PM
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the flames need to trade up to the 3rd pick and take whats-his-name.

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#5 RexLibris
May 05 2013, 08:00AM
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@thymebalm

I can tell you what I know of Lazar from several viewings, if that helps.

He's 6', probably finishes up just over 200lbs and perhaps an inch taller. He never takes a shift off and his point totals are likely going to skew more towards goals than assists.

He has a very good shot, good speed, funnels all of his play towards the net and is strong cycling the puck.

He is okay on the defensive side of his game but it isn't a tremendous strength although he plays on a team where that isn't crucial to their success owing to goaltending and an outstanding defensive corps.

He is listed at center (right-handed as well) but plays with wingers who are perhaps better at playmaking than he.

Ideally I believe he would best be suited to the wing, to play with a playmaking center.

He engages physically without hesitation and thrives when paired with similar players.

His most noticeable traits are his high level of competitiveness, speed and shot followed by a constant willingness to enter the high-traffic zones to gain scoring position.

He's not an elite or franchise talent, but if he were available at #20 around when the Flames select, they wouldn't go wrong in calling his name, in my opinion.

I should mention, there has been talk on in Edmonton about the Oilers trading back to pick up an immediate player and taking Lazar. This has made the fan base here extremely uncomfortable as they feel he would be a redundant asset with a lower talent ceiling than those available at #7.

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#6 shutout
May 05 2013, 05:47PM
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Need to draft entire first round by country.

Canadian - Monahan, Gauthier, Mantha

Russian - Nichushkin, Zadorov, Zykov

Swedish - Lindholm, Hagg, De La Rose

Finish - Barkov, Ristolainen, Lehkonen

Swiss - cant waste the first pick on a Swiss player but you can draft Mueller and then trade for Neiderreiter (or vice versa)

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#7 Kurt
May 05 2013, 08:19PM
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@T&A4Flames

You think Carolina would trade their 1st for Gio?!? That's crazy.

We have no asset that could get one of the top 5 picks. Carolina wouldnt trade that pick for any player we have. maybe not even any combination of players...

I think as fans we are collectively overvaluing the St Louis/pens picks and devaluing those coveted top 3 picks. It's a lot of fun to dream of trading up but it's just crazy talk...

Maybe I misunderstood??

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#8 shutout
May 05 2013, 10:50PM
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@burning

I agree with the idea that you take the best player available. And the three centers that I am looking for are generally considered the next three best players to take.

When you are evaluating best players you have to look at position because centermen are a lot more valuable than wingers. Name a team whose best player was a winger that has won anything substantial. Jagr won in Pittsburgh, but it was Lemieux (centerman) that was the star that drove that team not the winger. As for drafting a replacement for Iginla, what had the team ever won with Iginla that would make you think that it is a position of that much influence that you would overlook taking a higher rated centerman in the draft?

I am just hazarding a guess that you are taking about Nichushkin when you are playing devils advocate and arguing about taking Barkov, Lindholm, or Monahan. In this case you have to take into account the issues with Russian players over the last half dozen years and while there is high potential reward there, there is also a lot of high potential risk. And with a bare of an organization as there is in Calgary right now, you cannot afford to take those kind of risks when there are players just as good, more valuable, and less risky that you can take.

Lastly, the fact is that centermen are more valuable than almost any other position, and elite centermen are harder to trade than most other positions, so you need to draft them. Not because there is a hole in the lineup, but because they are rare and hard to find. Especially picking 6th overall. When they come around you should be doing all you can do to draft them, and as many of them as possible. Wingers are the least valuable commodity in the NHL and this needs to be taken into account when ranking and drafting players.

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#9 slambam
May 05 2013, 10:55PM
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I am amazed that so many people have an opinion on who should be taken. How many have seen these guys play in person or have seen more than a couple highlight reel goals on youtube? Its also amusing how most everyone is just regurgitating what they have been force fed by some media outlet. What I would like is for someone to have an opinion outside of the box and say the flames should take someone who central scouting has ranked at 128th and why he/she should be the flames first pick. Comon I come here to read stuff other than what I see on TSN. Lets come up with some originality here!

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#10 ИАТНАN
May 04 2013, 01:27PM
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If the Flames first round can go, Lindholm, Hagg and Zykov I will be ecstatic.

I think the most important thing is for the Flames to make safe picks and gamble with any other round, they have to make sure at least 2 out of the 3 make the NHL and are impact players.

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#11 Austin
May 04 2013, 01:35PM
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I think we need to look at Nichuskin just as seriously as Lindholm, Monahan, or Nurse. There's always the chance that we trade up to Tampa or Nashville's spot but that is fairly unlikely. What are the chances of us picking up another first round pick, in exchange for a roster player. I know the mandate is to make the playoffs next year, but a lot of guys we won't be re-signing when their contract expires anyways. I could see Mactavish doing something stupid like trading away like their seventh for one of our lower picks if we threw something else in. Thoughts on that? By the way we should not take any goalies in the first even if Fucale is their at 30. NO GOALIES.

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#12 Austin
May 04 2013, 01:35PM
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I think we need to look at Nichuskin just as seriously as Lindholm, Monahan, or Nurse. There's always the chance that we trade up to Tampa or Nashville's spot but that is fairly unlikely. What are the chances of us picking up another first round pick, in exchange for a roster player. I know the mandate is to make the playoffs next year, but a lot of guys we won't be re-signing when their contract expires anyways. I could see Mactavish doing something stupid like trading away like their seventh for one of our lower picks if we threw something else in. Thoughts on that? By the way we should not take any goalies in the first even if Fucale is their at 30. NO GOALIES.

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#13 ИАТНАN
May 04 2013, 01:42PM
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@Austin

With the elite talent available in the first 5 picks trading up will probably be near impossible.

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#14 T&A4Flames
May 04 2013, 02:07PM
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The strength in our system right now is at LW and goal. Our weaknesses are, obviously, at potential 1st line centres, right shooting RW and right shooting defencemen, more of the puck moving type. Not to mention size. Our best prospects are smaller.

With that said, I would like to see the Flames, and subsequently FN, target guys that cover those areas. Alexandre Barkov, Sean Monahan, Elias Lindholm, Fred Gauthier for centres. For D, Rasmus Ristolainen, Ryan Pulock, Madison Bowey would be my 1st choices, depending on where they end up in the draft. I would look at Steve Santini as well. The best RW options seems to be Valentin Zykov and Justin Bailey.

If we were able to move up to get a 2nd top 10, I would be ecstatic if we came away with Barkov and Ristolainen.

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#15 T&A4Flames
May 04 2013, 02:19PM
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I should clarify that I wouldn't be upset if we got Nurse or other specific players. However, given what I see as our organizational weaknesses, if Nurse and Ristolainen were both available, I would take Risto.

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#16 the-wolf
May 04 2013, 02:34PM
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Although always rated behind Lindholm I still think Monahan has a greater chance to be a 1C and brings it in terms of size, 200' play and the ability to make those around him better. He was top 3 on lists a year ago and was dominant in the CHL Siper Series. A year ago he'd have been a top 5 pick.

Agree that Nichushkin needs to be looked at closely though.

Also glad to see others are high on Zykov. I think he's very underrated. Calgary should easily be able to grab him as he's listed bottom of the 1st on most lists I've seen. But he's a big RW who can skate and score and works hard.

I also think we could get Domi and that he'll play in the NHL for sure.

Monahan, Domi and Zykov is my wish list.

I also like Wennberg and think he has more potential than Lindholm.

Nurse, Zadorov and Hagg are all fine D prospects as well.

Stay away from Gauthier, Mueller and Lazar.

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#17 RossCreekNation
May 04 2013, 02:47PM
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After Barkov, Monahan & Lindholm, I'd like to read more on:

Curtis Lazar, Bo Horvat, Kerby Rychel, Alexander Wennberg, Jacob De La Rose, Valentin Zykov, Madison Bowey, and then of course a few guys out of the US/NCAA like JT Compher, Ian McCoshen & Steve Santini.

And everybody else, too. Get to work!

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#18 RossCreekNation
May 04 2013, 02:54PM
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I'm not convinced the Flames will pick 3 times in the 1st round. But if they do, I'd suspect 1 D & 1 US based (USHL/NCAA/USNTDP) guy, perhaps 2 birds with 1 stone (McCoshen/Santini).

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#19 BurningSensation
May 04 2013, 03:15PM
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My prediction on the top 5:

1-2-3 in some order: Jones, MacKinnon, Drouin

4. Barkov-Nsh 5. ????

Carolina is the real wild card here, they could take anyone from Nurse, to Zadarov, to Nichushkin to Monahan or Lindholm. I'd be surprised if they targeted a C for that pick (specifically Monahan or Lindholm, as Nichushkin can play RW), but there is absolutely nothing certain about where they will go. I'd even put it at even odds the pick could be traded for.

Assuming then that Calgary has a choice of: Nichushkin, Lindholm, Monahan, I'd rank them in that order of preference.

Whatever risk there is with Nichushkin I think its worth it at pick #6 given there are lists who have him as high as #2.

I have Lindholm slightly favoured to Monahan because of the perception that Lindholm has a higher offensive ceiling and is a better developed skater vs Monahan.

I would agree that we should 'say No' to goaltenders in the 1st, even if Fucale is hanging around at the end of the draft. It's the one position (along with LW) where we have some depth in the system already.

For later round picks, I agree with those who like Bo Horvat, Max Domi and TJ Compher. After reading the Red Line Report on Anthony Mantha I can see why he projects as a late rounder rather than much higher up where his #'s suggest he should be. If he's our last pick in the 1st I'd be OK. Erne, Zykov and Rychel all would make fine power-winger projects IMO.

Dream board: Nichushkin (or Barkov if he miraculously slips to us), Zykov and Erne.

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#20 Baalzamon
May 04 2013, 03:26PM
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Really? Nic Petan doesn't even get a mention? From ANYONE? Ryan Hartman?

Oh right. They're "small".

I will barf if the Flames take Fucale.

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#21 Jeff Lebowski
May 04 2013, 03:35PM
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If Calgary could get Gauthier, Nichushkin and Santini that would be incredible.

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#22 Gmac84
May 04 2013, 03:41PM
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I think the flames MUST target a C with their first pick. I'd like to see them trade up a couple of spots to get Barkov, but i'd be fine with Monahan, or Lindholm.

After that it's a bit of a crap shoot based on where they're picking, and whether they've still got two more picks after the first one.

I'd like to see them target a defenseman like Hagg, or Bowey. I'd also love to get Ryan Hartman if he's still on the board.

Unfortunately, after years of being abused as a Flames fan, i'm kind of just waiting to be embarrassed by a boneheaded move by management. So all of this speculation is based on competent and rational thinking by the flames brass...something i just can't bring myself to expect.

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#23 RexLibris
May 04 2013, 03:43PM
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Back around January I had done up an article about depth picks the Oilers could target in the 2nd round. Some of those names may be worth mentioning here as late 1st round picks:

Fredrik Gauthier, Tristan Jarry, Samuel Morin, Kerby Rychel, Hudson Fasching, Jonathan Ismael Diaby, and Oliver Bjorkstrand.

I'm not saying the Flames should pick off that list for the last two 1st round picks, but I wouldn't be surprised to see at least one of those names taken.

If I were running the Flames draft board I'd probably pick Monahan, Lazar and Morin. A Center, winger (even though Lazar plays center his game is made for a power forward), and a big, nasty defenseman.

Nichushkin is a great prospect and could be among the top three of his draft class, but the Flames can't afford a gamble at that spot. They need money in the bank and Monahan or Lindholm are the surest bets at a crucial position. Hope they don't take a defenseman at #6.

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#24 BurningSensation
May 04 2013, 04:01PM
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RexLibris wrote:

Back around January I had done up an article about depth picks the Oilers could target in the 2nd round. Some of those names may be worth mentioning here as late 1st round picks:

Fredrik Gauthier, Tristan Jarry, Samuel Morin, Kerby Rychel, Hudson Fasching, Jonathan Ismael Diaby, and Oliver Bjorkstrand.

I'm not saying the Flames should pick off that list for the last two 1st round picks, but I wouldn't be surprised to see at least one of those names taken.

If I were running the Flames draft board I'd probably pick Monahan, Lazar and Morin. A Center, winger (even though Lazar plays center his game is made for a power forward), and a big, nasty defenseman.

Nichushkin is a great prospect and could be among the top three of his draft class, but the Flames can't afford a gamble at that spot. They need money in the bank and Monahan or Lindholm are the surest bets at a crucial position. Hope they don't take a defenseman at #6.

How is Nichushkin a 'gamble' at #6 when he is ranked as high as #2 on many draft boards? Because he 'might' prefer to play in the KHL? As far as I know exactly one guy has spurned the NHL to have his full career in Russia (Radulov), and the only other player who might be considered to be a risk is Kuznetsov - but he has pledged to come over after the Olympics (for the simple reason that the Russians are asking all their best young players to stay in the KHL or risk their spot on the Olympic team).

The real risk is that you leave an elite talent on the board for someone else to take while drafting a lesser player for yourself.

Given that Feaster and Weisbrod aren't afraid to swing for the fences I'd bet money that if Nichushkin is there at #6 they take him.

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#25 FireOnIce
May 04 2013, 04:28PM
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@Gmac84

You're going to love when Feaster & Co. trade 1 or 2 of those 1st rounders for Ryan Miller and/or Vincent Lacavalier.

I'm surprised the Avalanche are "expected" to pick Seth Jones. I understand he's top ranked and a damn good player, but the Avalanche have a bunch of really good young D-men, lead by former first overall pick Erik Johnson. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to pick up a #1C and then dump someone like Stastny or ROR for a good D-man who is ready now?

If Feaster hadn't signed ROR to an offer sheet, might they have been able to fleece COL in a Blouwmeester trade?

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#26 BurningSensation
May 04 2013, 05:11PM
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FireOnIce wrote:

You're going to love when Feaster & Co. trade 1 or 2 of those 1st rounders for Ryan Miller and/or Vincent Lacavalier.

I'm surprised the Avalanche are "expected" to pick Seth Jones. I understand he's top ranked and a damn good player, but the Avalanche have a bunch of really good young D-men, lead by former first overall pick Erik Johnson. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to pick up a #1C and then dump someone like Stastny or ROR for a good D-man who is ready now?

If Feaster hadn't signed ROR to an offer sheet, might they have been able to fleece COL in a Blouwmeester trade?

The Erik Johnson trade has been an unmitigated disaster for the AV's.

Johnson's offense has all but abandoned him completely, and he isn't a high end shut down guy, while Shattenkirk has developed into on of the better offensive D-men for St Louis, and Stewart appears to be at least a serviceable power forward. .

The notable guys on D that they have coming along are Stefan Elliott and Tyson Barrie, but both are offense first types and leave lots to be desired in their own endzone.

Factor in that Jones is essentially a Denver kid, plays a position of weakness for the Avs, and is widely considered the BPA, and I think it is a slam dunk they take him.

The problem the Avs have with Stastny is two fold, A. he is very expensive, and B. he hasn't been very good since signing his contract. He's a candidate to be bought out more than he is to be traded. ROR is value for his deal (see Corey Pronman's post on the ROR offer sheet at Hockey Prospectus), so I expect they will keep him (and for that matter because they matched the offer sheet they are prohibited from trading him for another year).

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#27 RexLibris
May 04 2013, 05:47PM
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@BurningSensation

I'm as impatient with the proverbial "Russian Factor" as anyone, basing draft eligibility on nationality is odious to me.

What factors into my suggesting that Nichushkin is a gamble is that he is, so far as I know, the only player listed here who currently is signed to a professional contract in a rival league.

Leaving aside issues of xenophobia and nationalism which often play into the hyperbole surrounding specifically elite level Russian players at the draft, I believe that taking Nichushkin would be a gamble for a team like the Flames who also need a center more than a winger.

If, for any reason, he were to decide to stay in Russia to play for another two years, could Feaster and Weisbrod really be in a position to risk that? It would likely benefit the Flames in the long run, but could push those two closer to the exit door if they can't show subtantial improvement next season.

I don't think that at #6 the Flames will be left with picking a lesser player over Nichushkin.

For the sake of full disclosure, my preference for the Oilers' pick would be one of either Monahan or Nichushkin. But the Oilers could afford to absorb an absentee 1st round pick at forward for a season or two.

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#28 BurningSensation
May 04 2013, 06:50PM
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RexLibris wrote:

I'm as impatient with the proverbial "Russian Factor" as anyone, basing draft eligibility on nationality is odious to me.

What factors into my suggesting that Nichushkin is a gamble is that he is, so far as I know, the only player listed here who currently is signed to a professional contract in a rival league.

Leaving aside issues of xenophobia and nationalism which often play into the hyperbole surrounding specifically elite level Russian players at the draft, I believe that taking Nichushkin would be a gamble for a team like the Flames who also need a center more than a winger.

If, for any reason, he were to decide to stay in Russia to play for another two years, could Feaster and Weisbrod really be in a position to risk that? It would likely benefit the Flames in the long run, but could push those two closer to the exit door if they can't show subtantial improvement next season.

I don't think that at #6 the Flames will be left with picking a lesser player over Nichushkin.

For the sake of full disclosure, my preference for the Oilers' pick would be one of either Monahan or Nichushkin. But the Oilers could afford to absorb an absentee 1st round pick at forward for a season or two.

Given that most players require at couple of years to develop after being drafted (see Baertschi), having Nichushkin stay in the KHL where he is comfortable to refine his game doesn't bother me in the least.

It's only a team like the Oilers that insists on rushing every 1st rounder into the NHL ASAP.

The other issue you mention is that Nichushkin is considered a winger. Initially this was a concern for me too, but there are two reasons this doesn't bother me much anymore;

- when he has played on the wing it was as a RW, a position that Calgary has almost no solid prospects at.

- he has apparently played a not inconsiderable amount of time at C both at the Jr level and in the KHL.

For me it comes done to his offensive ceiling - and every scouting report I've seen has him as one of the 2 or 3 best offensive players in the draft.

Feaster and Weisbrod took Jankowski knowing they would have to wait and see what he looks like after a couple of years, I can't imagine they would pass on Nichushkin just because he won't arrive next fall to compete for a roster spot as an 18 year old.

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#29 clYDE
May 04 2013, 06:56PM
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T&A4Flames wrote:

The strength in our system right now is at LW and goal. Our weaknesses are, obviously, at potential 1st line centres, right shooting RW and right shooting defencemen, more of the puck moving type. Not to mention size. Our best prospects are smaller.

With that said, I would like to see the Flames, and subsequently FN, target guys that cover those areas. Alexandre Barkov, Sean Monahan, Elias Lindholm, Fred Gauthier for centres. For D, Rasmus Ristolainen, Ryan Pulock, Madison Bowey would be my 1st choices, depending on where they end up in the draft. I would look at Steve Santini as well. The best RW options seems to be Valentin Zykov and Justin Bailey.

If we were able to move up to get a 2nd top 10, I would be ecstatic if we came away with Barkov and Ristolainen.

If we were able to move up and get one of Zadorov or Routsalainen with our second pick that would be tremendous. Many people do not feel Gauthier has a very high offensive ceiling and was not very good at the U18 tourney and neither was the Russian. Lindholme - 1st. I have this feeling that Barkov may fall to 6 and I don't think the Flames would pass him up. I like Lindhome personally. A trade up to get one of those top 5 def with our second pick. Nurse, Jones will be gone but Routselainen, Zadorov and Poulouk look to be very promising. If def goes early, that would mean that Domi or Skinkaruk have slipped and that wouldn't be so bad. Third pick - Rychel. I think he will slide and that pisses him off to the point that he will spend the next 12 years proving everyone wrong as he is a tremendous competitor.

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#30 clYDE
May 04 2013, 06:59PM
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the-wolf wrote:

Although always rated behind Lindholm I still think Monahan has a greater chance to be a 1C and brings it in terms of size, 200' play and the ability to make those around him better. He was top 3 on lists a year ago and was dominant in the CHL Siper Series. A year ago he'd have been a top 5 pick.

Agree that Nichushkin needs to be looked at closely though.

Also glad to see others are high on Zykov. I think he's very underrated. Calgary should easily be able to grab him as he's listed bottom of the 1st on most lists I've seen. But he's a big RW who can skate and score and works hard.

I also think we could get Domi and that he'll play in the NHL for sure.

Monahan, Domi and Zykov is my wish list.

I also like Wennberg and think he has more potential than Lindholm.

Nurse, Zadorov and Hagg are all fine D prospects as well.

Stay away from Gauthier, Mueller and Lazar.

I too agree with your last sentence.

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#31 RossCreekNation
May 04 2013, 07:04PM
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@BurningSensation

I've only seen Nicushkin listed as a LW, not as a RW or a C.

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#32 RossCreekNation
May 04 2013, 07:09PM
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Dream scenario: Jones, Drouin, MacKinnon go 1/2/3, then Nashville, with Filip Forsberg already in the fold, opt for Lindholm & Carolina stunningly leave Barkov there for Calgary at 6 (which incidently, is what THN has happening).

Although, I guess if we're pitching dream scenarios... trade up for MacKinnon.

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#33 Baalzamon
May 04 2013, 07:53PM
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@RossCreekNation

You're obviously not looking in very many places then, because I've seen Nichushkin listed in every possible combination of forward positions. Generally (fyi) if a player plays all 3, he's lazily listed at LW for no particular reason (or RW if he has a right handed shot). Nichushkin played RW at the WJC btw.

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#34 FireOnIce
May 04 2013, 08:28PM
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Flames need to trade all their picks for Ryan Miller and Vincent Lacavalier. JOKINEN! IS! AVAILABLE!

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#35 Tommynotsohuge
May 04 2013, 09:02PM
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@RossCreekNation

I've seen Lazar play quite a bit this year. This guy is a true competitor. He isn't afraid to throw his body around. He absolutely crushed Roach a few times in this past series. If he could drop to the 20s, we'd be stupid not to take him.

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#36 Parallex
May 04 2013, 09:37PM
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Guys I'd like to hear more about would be Rychel, Horvat, S. Morin, Mantha, and De La Rose.

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#37 Parallex
May 04 2013, 09:47PM
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... and the guy I want the Flames to avoid is Gauthier. As far as I'm concerned if you're 6'5 210 playing in a youth league then you ought to do better then he did if you're a legit 1st round guy.

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#38 backburner
May 04 2013, 10:12PM
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Baalzamon wrote:

Really? Nic Petan doesn't even get a mention? From ANYONE? Ryan Hartman?

Oh right. They're "small".

I will barf if the Flames take Fucale.

I would really like to see a profile on Nic Petan.

I know the Flames are trying to address the size issue now, but, you cant ignore his point totals!!

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#39 clYDE
May 04 2013, 10:16PM
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backburner wrote:

I would really like to see a profile on Nic Petan.

I know the Flames are trying to address the size issue now, but, you cant ignore his point totals!!

Playing a great deal with Leipsic on a very loaded team. Seems to be more of a complementary player and is very small.

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#40 RossCreekNation
May 04 2013, 10:29PM
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@Baalzamon

Hm, right you are. The most prominent position I've seen him listed at is LW or F, but a quick search also tells me RW & C too.

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#41 Franko J
May 04 2013, 11:20PM
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The Flames need to add some size to their line-up. With 8 possible picks Feaster and the Flames should come away from this draft with further building blocks to renovating the roster.

Pick # 6 I am going with Sean Monahan. He is a player I targeted at the beginning of the season. Comparable: Sean Couturier.

St. Louis Pick: Toss up between McCoshen or Vanelli. With the Flames management penchant for US / NCAA bound players I can see them picking a D.

Pittsburgh Pick: Justin Bailey. This years off the board "Jankowski" pick. Plenty of upsize to his game. Already has the size, just needs some seasoning.

Honourable Mention: Nic Petan,Curtis Lazar, Madison Bowey,Shea Theodore, Samuel Morin, and Frederik Gauthier.

Other notable picks in later rounds:

John Hayden, Ryan Kujawinksi, Viktor Crus-Rydberg, Tyler Hill, Zach Sanford, Hudson Fasching {sleeper pick}, Justin Auger, Felix Westermark, Jerrett Smith, Mitchell Wheaton.

If the Flames can match their 2011 draft with potential prospects I would be satisfied.

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#42 RexLibris
May 04 2013, 11:50PM
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@BurningSensation

If Feaster and Weisbrod take Nichushkin I'd applaud their chutzpah. More so than the trade down for Jankowski.

I'm certain that if the Flames had been in a position to select one of Taylor Hall, Ryan Nugent-Hopkins or Nail Yakupov they would have certainly left them in junior to mature.

The list of 1st overall players who were not playing in the NHL the following year is not very long and the most recent example is Erik Johnson. Prior to that you have to go back to Bryan Berard in 1995 to find one that was returned to junior after being drafted.

True, the Russian information on positions is, shall we say, vague at best. And often they have forwards who are expected to play all forward positions depending on the coach's system and linemates. With regards to that I would expect that the scouts have an eye on which position best suits his game.

I won't argue that the Flames need RWs. Desperately. They have ignored that position for decades.

I'm not suggesting that the Flames would be silly to take him. He could very well be the 2nd best forward prospect in the draft based on skill alone, behind Drouin. I just argue that given the Flames almost complete lack of center prospects, given the limited ceiling of Reinhart and the question marks surrounding Jankowski, the best bet might be to take the franchise center if he falls in your lap.

If the Flames get another crack at one of the top three draft spots either next year or the year after, and somehow have a chance to take either Sam Reinhart or even Connor McDavid, it isn't as though you can have too much talent down the middle.

Then again, perhaps another team decides they want the big Russian and take a gamble with him before #6.

I can see Weisbrod passing on Nichushkin if they feel that there is a better talent-for-position fit with another prospect.

That being said, this is all pretty much academic as none of us know what their draft board looks like and we don't know what other teams may do between 1 and 5. Although I think we could probably say with certainty that Nashville will not be interested in Nichushkin, regardless of skill.

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#43 thymebalm
May 05 2013, 02:58AM
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I want to see profiles on Nurse, Morrissey, and Petan/Lazar... something like that. I figure we'll get Monahan with pick 1, but maybe Morrissey and Petan/Lazar will be available around the late 20s... there are other guys too... I'll think and post later

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#44 thymebalm
May 05 2013, 03:00AM
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Kryby Rychel

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#45 BurningSensation
May 05 2013, 10:50AM
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@Rex Libris

- One thing Feaster has shown at the draft is a willingness to take risks

- The Nuge would almost certainly have been sent back for another year. Not certain about Hall/Yakupov - both would likely have been good enough to make the team outright (especially Hall)

- My friend and I used to joke about Russian stats and what they meant; '22 games, 0 goals, 3 assists: the player is a high-end offensive weapon with an exploding shot and supreme skating ability', or '30 games, 5 goals, 38 assists; classic stay at home defenseman with size, but offense is limited', we just had no idea what to make of a player based on just the raw stats. Positions for forwards are in the same boat.

- I'm holding out hope (cuz that is all it is) that Nichushkin is available AND that he will be able to play C. He would check all the boxes then for Flames dream draft pick (aside from KHL risk however you measure it).

- You can NEVER have too many skill pivots. Never. They are always in demand and as a currency they bring way more back in return than just about anything else.

- I doubt that Nashville would prefer Nichushkin to Barkov in any circumstance. Barkov is essentially the prototype pivot they (and the Flames) lack. Nichushkin, whatever his upside, wouldn't be slotted ahead of him (IMO).

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#46 SmellOfVictory
May 05 2013, 10:57AM
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Not sure who's been mentioned yet, but: Shea Theodore, Mirco Mueller, Nicolas Petan, Josh Morrissey, Max Domi

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#47 RexLibris
May 05 2013, 11:46AM
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@BurningSensation

I agree with you about Feaster being willing to take risks. No debate there.

I doubt the Flames would have sent Nugent-Hopkins back, but that has more to do with their perennial search for centers. Either way, it's not really a point worth much debate. I suspect in this year's draft MacKinnon and Barkov could be NHL-ready and Monahan and Lindholm perhaps could use another year.

That is pretty funny about the Russian prospect/scouting report. Agreed. The information that historically has come out hasn't helped to deter the natural xenophobia amongst many NHL managers and scouts.

So we can put you down as being a strong member of the Nichushkin camp at #6? If they move up, presumably either he or Barkov?

I think we agree on centers. That is why the talk of the Oilers trading down for Lazar or taking Nurse at #7 is getting people rattled here. We know Gagner isn't here long-term and Nugent-Hopkins is alone on an island in their middle depth chart. They need a player like Monahan very badly. They could also use a trade for someone like Adam Henrique, but I'm not sure how that could happen.

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#49 BurningSensation
May 05 2013, 12:51PM
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@Rex Libris

Yeah, I'm definitely in the camp hoping that Nichushkin slips to pick #6. I confess a strong preference for the big 'Frank Mahovolich' types who have 'fear-my-wingspan' moves (Jagr, Malkin, Nash, etc.).

I would love to get MacKinnon (or Drouin), but recognize that is all but impossible. Barkov? Fits us to a T, so I am hoping like mad he slips.

If I had a nickel every time I read an Oiler fan propose "Gagner+something = #1 Defenseman!" I'd be a zillionaire.

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#50 RexLibris
May 05 2013, 03:15PM
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@BurningSensation

Mahovlich still resonates with fans. A credit to his skill.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Nichushkin slide to 6th. Not sold that the Flames take him, but I expect he'll be there. Carolina is the wild card as far as I can tell.

For what its worth, I expect it'll go Jones (COL), Drouin (FLA), MacKinnon (TBL), Barkov (NSH).

If we were to go out on a limb and suggest that the Hurricanes take Nurse that leaves some very attractive options for the Flames. They could (perish the thought) trade back with the Oilers and pick up a 2nd round pick in the deal and still possibly take the player they want.

I suspect the Oilers will try to move Hemsky at the draft. Not sure for what or to whom, but there are always talks on the floor and with the whole thing taking place in one day this year it could open things up to a little more wheeling and dealing.

Gagner has some value but he is not the equivalent to an established top defenseman right now. That being said, I wouldn't put it past MacTavish to give Nonis a call on Gardiner, if only because Carlyle has his head up his tukhes on the young blueliner and I have to wonder about the ability of any GM who would keep that man employed in the NHL today.

So I guess then I'd owe you a nickel? ;-)

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