The Half-Way Roundtable

Ryan Pike
January 10 2014 10:24AM

We've crossed over the 41-game mark of the 2013-14 Calgary Flames season and are past the half-way point. To get a sense of how the club is doing on (and off) the ice, we've gathered the FlamesNation posse for another edition of the Roundtable.

Join myself, Kent Wilson, Byron Bader, Christian Roatis, Justin Azevedo and the Book of Loob, and add your take in the comments!

The Flames are low on elite talent but seemed to be high on hard work early on. What's your take on their on-ice struggles over the past few weeks?

Kent: Talent eventually rises to the top. It's a fallacy that teams can simply "out-work" severe talent deficits in the NHL over the long term. These are pro athletes all being driven by pro coaches and organizations - they all work hard. The difference is, some have more talent than others. The Flames don't.

Byron: I think the better teams in the league have started to play a little more intense, to shore up those playoff spots. The Flames impressed early on their hardwork and forechecking, which led to a lot of goals. As teams are playing further into the season, the games are getting more intense by the day. They're watching more and more video and have a better understanding of the Flames tendencies. As a result, that hard work that got them through the first few months just isn't enough anymore. They don't have the horses to play with the big boys.

Christian: They're gassed, in my opinion. Teams have out skilled and out classed them since the beginning of the year, but their insane work ethic and grind kept them in games. That doesn't seem to stand all too true of late. To me, it seems they've lost some of that work, not from lack of trying, but from lack of resources. To put it simply, they're pooped. I think we'll see a resurgence of sorts after the Olympic break, but until then we're looking at some painfully ugly, rebuild hockey.

Justin: Their on-ice struggles or successes have nothing to do with hard work. I doubt the level of effort they’ve demonstrated over the course of the year has varied much. They got lucky early on, averaging about 3.5 goals per game through the first 20 or so. That was, and is, unsustainable when you’re averaging less than 30 shots per game. As the scoring has regressed to the mean, so has the goaltending - but since it hasn’t really kept pace with the dip in scoring, it’s resulted in these losses. They’ve had some bad scoring luck; it’ll even out and they’ll start winning a few again. However, don’t expect it to improve drastically: the team’s Corsi% is cratering.

Book of Loob: Well, it's pretty obvious that they're just not a good enough team talent wise, but that's not a total surprise. The work ethic in nice, great in fact, that's one thing I hope never goes away and an area where I'll give Bob Hartley credit. They have a system and they stick to it. The problem is, they just don't have the personnel to play their system and be consistently good at it. When it's a rebuild, these things happen. You can see some of the young talent in Abbotsford and junior/college slotting into the system soon enough, but right now, woof.

Ryan: I've mentioned this here and there, but the impression I get from watching this team this month versus in October is that this group isn't surprising anybody anymore. The hockey world is a shockingly small world, and news of the Flames lunch-bucket mentality has spread. As such, nobody's half-assing any of their contests with the boys in red and black. As a result, teams get on the gas pedal against the Flames in the first (rather in the third) and the games are a tad less competitive.

Related to the prior point, after 40-ish games, has your opinion of Bob Hartley as Calgary Flames head coach changed?

Kent: Meh. He seems to have finally settled on rational player usage after a few bumpy weeks in November. I still don't quite understand the treatment of Sven Baertschi overall, but that seems to be an organization thing as much as a coach thing. Overall I think he's fairly mediocre - certainly not a Tippett or Bylsma level coach who will be able to draw more out a line-up than your average coach. I could do without his need to dress an enforcer every night though.

Byron: My opinion has changed a little throughout the season. Earlier on when he was benching Backlund and Sven almost exclusively it seemed like there was something he really didn't like about those two. But now that I see him rotating everybody through the 4th line when they're not going, Colborne and Monahan included, it's a little bit easier to take. If a guy's not playing well and isn't putting up huge offensive numbers he'll drop down the depth chart a little and I'm ok with that. He's done well with what he has. He has a system that keeps the Flames in most games which is about the most you can expect from the group. I'd give him a B+

Christian: I'm a bigger fan of Hartley now, than I was at the beginning of the year. I think he's done a masterful job with the crew he's been provided with and the circumstances he was put in. A great point was made by Rob Kerr on the Fan960 the other day and I paraphrase, "if past teams like the ones after the first lockout which were Top 10 in NHL perennially had the same work ethic and attitude as the guys in the locker room this year do, they've gotten a lot further in achieving their goals." I couldn't agree more. Hartley has the right mindset and work ethic instilled in these guys, they're just not good enough on their own to translate that into wins. I'd like Hartley to get a shot with a quality roster, but that's probably unlikely.

Justin: No. He hasn’t really adjusted until he’s been forced to and he’s not providing plus coaching value.

Book of Loob: Nah. Again, credit to him to get what he's got working as hard as they are, that's an admirable trait in a coach, but beyond that, damn. He still does not demonstrate a clear vision when it comes to playing his charges in the situations in which they'll thrive. He's come around on Mikael Backlund, who truly has earned the ice he's getting now, but some of his moves are maddening. He's wasting Jiri Hudler's skill set by playing him so frequently with David Jones and Joe Colborne, and why you'd EVER need to have Brian McGrattan and Kevin Westgarth in the lineup at the same time (or at all, but that's a fight I know I'll never win) is beyond me. I think that last point might be a directive coming from Brian Burke so I won't put it completely on Bobby, but he seems like he'd be more than happy to do it anyway. Let's just say I'm glad Sven is safe in Abby.

Ryan: I have a lot of time for Bob Hartley generally, as he's gotten more out of this group than I would've expected prior to the regular season. I'm not sure his "tough love" approach goes over as well with some players as with others, though.

You're the GM. Assuming that Joey MacDonald's not in your plans, which of the organization's four pro goaltenders (Karri Ramo, Reto Berra, Joni Ortio and Olivier Roy) do you move forward into 2014-15 with?

Kent: I'd stick with all of them. Well, not Roy, but keep the rest. Unless an obvious upgrade suddenly jumps into the club's lap, there's no reason to toss any of them aside.

Byron: Well both Ramo and Berra are playing quite well of late after slower starts. Ortio is doing pretty well in the AHL and Roy isn't doing too bad either in the ECHL. It's a tough call. I would probably keep Ramo up with the Flames, bring up Ortio and perhaps try and trade Berra to a contender in need of a back-up goalie. Next year I would let Roy have a job in Abbotsford while also signing Jon Gilles out of Providence and let him get equal starts with Roy in the AHL for a year to see if he has the "right stuff."

Christian: Ramo is on my team for sure, I've really liked what he's provided. Almost exactly as advertised, in my opinion. Unfortunately the team in front of him stinks. I most certainly give Ortio a shot in training camp to establish himself as a backup goaltender, competing most likely against Berra, although I haven't made up my mind on him yet. Some nights he looks great, others he looks like Henrik Karlsson. I'd probably search for an established 'tender in Free Agency or through trade, depending on who's available and at what cost. Roy is pretty interchangeable in the ECHL, but I guess I'll hold onto him for one more year to see if he's made any real strides.

Justin: Honestly, I roll with all four again probably. I don’t know if Ortio is ready to play 30+ games in the NHL next year, Roy has shown some positive results and is still 22 but is nowhere near NHL-ready and I’d be hesitant to give Rämö more than 50 appearances. Berra will be cheap to resign and this team sucks, so you might as well try to mould him into something; if it doesn’t happen, who cares. Ideally Rämö and Berra go about 50/30 at the NHL level while Ortio and Roy split starts in the AHL. At this point, I doubt Gillies makes the jump from the NCAA.

Book of Loob: I had a pretty lengthy discussion about this on twitter a while back, and I don't really know where my own opinion on this ended up. A lot of it depends on what happens with Jon Gillies and whether or not he goes back to school or tries the Abbotsford route next season. If he does go pro, you need to make sure he gets a lot of starts (A LOT of starts), and if that means flipping him between Abby and Alaska, then so be it, but he needs to play.
It also depends on how seriously competitive the organization intends to be next season. I don't believe they CAN be competitive next year unless they go full Holmgren on the free agent market. As such, I'd roll a tandem of Ramo and Ortio next season. Berra is a free agent, and if (and this is an if for sure) Bob Hartley isn't next year's coach, I don't see a spot for Reto on the team. Ortio has been fantastic in the minors this season, and I think he's been good enough for at least a shot at being the guy in Calgary next season, but a tandem role with Ramo probably suits both of them the best.
That said, I'm for more time with Ortio in the minors as well. Supposing the Flames get themselves something resembling an established starter for next season (and I don't know what that is, but let's call him James Reimer) a solution of Ortio in Abby with Gillies and Roy flipping back and forth between Abby and Alaska (Again, you have to get Gillies a lot of starts, this kid is undeniably the future of the Flames crease) that probably keeps everyone happy. I don't think anyone has any serious designs on the development of Olivier Roy beyond a warm body, and neither do I.

Ryan: Short of the Flames finding a magical goaltending solution on the free agent market, I probably go to war with three of the four guys - sending Olivier Roy elsewhere. And I do what I can to get Jon Gillies signed, as I'm not sure another year dominating the NCAA is really that good for him.

You're the President of Hockey Operations. Who do you hire to be your general manager and why?

Kent: If I was the President of Hockey Ops, the question might be relevant, but with Burke there it probably isn't. Whoever comes in will have to be Burke guy through-and-through since the erstwhile Leafs GM will have the final say on trades and signings anyways.

Byron: I'm probably in the minority here but I'd probably try and get Darcy Regier. He has his faults. Many of which could be attributed to his over zealous owner, Terry Pegulas, pushing for a winner too early and being too aggressive in the free agent market. But after what Regier got for Vanek (Moulson - a player that actually has more points than Vanek in the last few years, a 1st and a 2nd) I have faith in his trade abilities. Put a stable ownership group that's willing to spend but doesn't NEED to spend right now and I think he'd be great for the rebuild.

Christian: It's a tough one for me between Bruins AGM Jim Benning and Preds AGM Paul Fenton, but I lean to Fenton, mostly because of past draft results. Besides the obvious picks in the first round, Fenton - who I understand is mostly tasked with Nashville's amateur scouting business - has found diamonds in the rough in later rounds like Roman Josi, Mattias Eklund among others. Heck, Finland just won World Junior Gold on the back of late round Fenton find, Juuse Saros!

Justin: Well, if I was president I would probably hire Gabe Desjardins, but I don’t think that’s what the question is asking. Paul Fenton, Ron Hextall, Laurence Gilman - those would be my top three guys. Really, anyone that shows a plus drafting record and intimate understanding of the cap is a good starting point. I would also like my candidate to have (at the very least) a cursory understanding of advanced hockey statistics.

Book of Loob: None of the guys who are currently on the short list. And that's not a knock on their credentials or the ability to do the job, they're probably all very qualified (that said, a HARD NO to Dave Poulin. That guy does not, to me, indicate that he gets it), but they're on the list now because they would essentially be the yes men Brian Burke is looking for, and that is not a good thing.
I don't think any GM the team brings in will ever have the full autonomy to do the job they want to do, but if you could bring in someone, for lack of a better term, more Burke-esque, someone with an alpha personality of their own, that's probably the closest you'd get. Someone that wouldn't hesitate to stand up to Burke if he disagrees. Ron Hextall, to me, seems like that guy, unfortunately I think the Flyers are aware that Holmgren is a dead man walking and Hextall could be the guy their sooner rather than later.
Plus those kind of hires just aren't likely. Can't see Burke hiring a guy he knows is going to oppose his own vision unless he really wants to get that barn fight in.
Come to think of it, that'd be a great way for a new GM to voice his concerns.

Ryan: My gut says we'll end up with somebody previously affliated with Brian Burke, like Laurence Gilman, Dave Poulin or Claude Loiselle. I hope that, as either AGM or GM, the club grabs somebody like Kevin McDonald, Paul Fenton, Mike Futa or Jason Botterill.

Which Abbotsford Heat players do you bring up to the NHL once the team jettisons veterans on March 5 and needs human bodies to fill out the roster?

Kent: I imagine guys like Reinhart, Granlund and Knight will get a cup of coffee before the year ends.

Byron: Well if we look at who's likely to go, you have Cammalleri, Stajan, Stempniak and maybe Butler. So you're top sniper and two of your top 5 two-way players are out the door and a 5/6 dman. In that case, I would probably bring up Sven (pending he's performing to the degree he should be in the AHL at that point), Knight, Reinhart and Wotherspoon. Sven because he has the most offensive skill and vision. Corban Knight because he's been a good two-way force in Abby and is a killer in the dot. Max Reinhart because he's probably the most likely and most experienced to fill that winger role. I'd bring up Wotherspoon because I think he would be the best fit for that 5/6 spot. I'm sure a bunch of guys are going to get looks and it'll be a revolving door but those are the guys that I would bring up with the greatest regularity.

Christian: Corban Knight and Markus Granlund are two guys that have definitely earned it, in my opinion. Granlund especially, after he was given the call-up tour and didn't even get to play. Baertschi is another but needs to find some offense and consistent play before he's brought back up. On the blueline, seeing a Wotherspoon or Sieloff would be cool, but it's important not to rush them up. I'm also in favour of leaving Ortio in the minors a full year before bringing him up, barring injury.

Justin: Assuming Bouma, Byron, Jones and Smith all remain on the main roster, I’d call up Chad Billins, Ben Hanowski, Mark Cundari and Corban Knight. The contracts of the first three expire this season and (in my opinion) all three are at the point where they need to prove they are NHLers if they are going to get another contract. Knight has played well in Abbotsford and it will be a nice transition after spending the entire season there to Calgary - where I believe he’ll stay permanently.

Book of Loob: Let's be good and clear about this right now so we can all get a good cry out: We have not seen the end of Lane McDermid.
But if it were me, there's no shortage of guys that will have their shot. Markus Granlund was recalled this season and would've checked into the lineup if not for it coinciding with the Kevin Westgarth Experiment (great band name, by the way), and I suspect he'll get his shot eventually. He's earned it too, he's had a terrific season.
Corban Knight is another one I expect to see. I'm honestly surprised this much season has passed without him putting on the Flaming C. He's also had a great season, AND he's a big boy with local roots, it seems like a no brainer.
I'd like to see Ferland get his shot depending on how he does recovering from his injury, and I wouldn't be surprised for Sven to get another late season Renaissance like he had last year.
The real problem is there are no real defensive veterans on their way out, so unless they just decide a lot of the bottom 3 guys can be worth waiver wire demotions, guys like Wotherspoon and Ramage and an uninjured Sieloff may not be seen around these parts too much, which is too bad. Abbotsford has more defensive depth than we really give them credit for considering Calgary's own D is something of a tire fire past the top 4.

Ryan: First off, I hope that the team brings in some bodies as part of their deadline deals so the need to strip-mine Abbotsford for parts isn't too crazy. But I probably keep two or three roster spots open and rotate guys through for a road trip or a home-stand at a time. I figure we see Markus Granlund, Max Reinhart, Ben Hanowski, Corban Knight and Chad Billins for sure, and maybe Patrick Sieloff if he seems to be a decent player after his lengthy time off. Maybe a start or two for Joni Ortio, as well.

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Now in his third full season covering the Calgary Flames and the NHL, Ryan Pike is a Calgary native and FlamesNation's managing editor. He's trying to keep his head up, his stick on the ice and is giving it 110% every shift. You can also find his work at The Hockey Writers, the Wrestling Observer and Tough Talk MMA.
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#1 MonsterPod
January 10 2014, 12:35PM
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Funny how so many fans said 'good riddance' to Iggy and JBow, believing we'd be better off without them. Iggy's drifting and Jbow's lack of physicality. Well it certainly looks like we're a whole lot worse without them. Does that speak to their impact?

That said, I am glad they're gone and also think we should have started the rebuild in 2010, but when ownership meddles, our opinions are cold farts. The fact that we got so little for both of them and nothing for Kipper will prolong this rebuild significantly.

Who should be the GM? Puppet McPuppet. I want Burke to run the show.

Aside from creating cap space and retaining compliance buyouts, I squirmed and face-palmed almost everything Feaster did. I am thrilled Burke is on course to reverse this ship of wimps and midgets. Burke hasn't done anything yet. And please boys, Westgarth is a nothing move.

The team we are watching is Feaster's vision. They're small and skilled and hard-working and horrible. Keep Gio and Monahan -- burn the rest down.

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#2 Primo
January 10 2014, 03:33PM
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Keepers on current roster.....Monahan, Giordano, McGrattan, Brodie, Russell

Keepers in AHL....Ortio, Baertschi, Ferland, Seiloff, Knight, Hanowski, Street, Reinhart, Wotherspoon,

Keepers in draft/college....Goudreau, Arnold, Gillies, Poirier, Klimchuk, Kanzig, Jankowski

New GM...interview process to confirm top candidate with strongest draft record/knowledge and ability to work with Burke. Also new Scouting Director(s) will be critical and include a strong international knowledge component.

New coach....Hartley is not the coach for a younger development team. He is most effective with an established team of veterans. Goodbye Mr. Hartley.

Trades....critical to maximize returns for Hudler, Wideman with established veterans that provide toughness, size and scoring touch. Everyone else maximize returns with draft choices and/or prospects that fit the Burke mold.

STRATEGY...Trade for a star player possibly package Hudler/Wideman. Next secure a top rated veteran goalie. Market confirms there are a number of viable options available.

My 2 cents...Go Flamers!!

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#3 Walter White
January 10 2014, 03:06PM
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I know it's much too early to judge Burke on his body of work in Calgary, but his body of work in Toronto is fair game....I'm not impressed.

WW

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#4 SmellOfVictory
January 10 2014, 02:36PM
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cunning_linguist wrote:

Somebody told me that Kipper is currently playing forward for a beer league hockey team in Black Diamond. Let's give him a shot.

Honestly I would fully support seeing Kipper come back as a 4th line forward. He can't be any worse than the goons.

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#5 Rhode Appel
January 10 2014, 02:49PM
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And you thought being shut out by the Oilers at home is the season low point.......not even close yet. Judging by the delayed(?)response to a well thought out and crafted blog by the Nation contributors I would venture to say the the low point will finally be called indifference. *crickets*

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#6 Graham
January 10 2014, 12:56PM
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@MonsterPod

'Aside from creating cap space and retaining compliance buyouts, I squirmed and face-palmed almost everything Feaster did. I am thrilled Burke is on course to reverse this ship of wimps and midgets. Burke hasn't done anything yet. And please boys, Westgarth is a nothing move.'

I with you on the thrilled part... Feaster was a decent guy, but a terrible Hockey GM. He is likely to be remembered for two things, picking Jankowski when Teravaninen was available, and the dismal JBO trade (a Cdn Olympic top four defender for a late first rounder and two no name prospects)

I'm old enough to remember when opposing teams feared coming to Calgary, the Flames had skill size and a mean streak. Here's to Burke restoring some of these qualities.

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#7 Graham
January 10 2014, 12:44PM
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A couple of the AGM like Benson or Fenton look interesting, but I wonder if the Flames can afford to go the 'inexperienced GM' route. Horrible memories of GM's like Craig Button and the damage they can do come flashing to mind... Burke being Burke, its going to be someone he has dealt with before, someone with lots of experience, and the credibilty to 'restore' the reputation of the front office. Like em or hate them Regier and Poulin seem to fit the direction Burke wants to go.

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#8 everton fc
January 10 2014, 02:48PM
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Good article. Covered a lot of ground.

My feelings:

I like Botterill. I like Fenton (who doesn't?) Hextall will never leave Philly. But we probably get someone Burke's worked with, in the past. Typical of recent moves here in Calgary.

Hartley's probably done the best he could with the spare parts and also-rans he's been tasked with. Work ethic matters. A better roster than the expansion-level group we currently have here would be a possible playoff contender (albeit 6-8 spot). But I don't think he's around next season, for he's not Burke's man.

Farm hands I'd like to see up here:

Obviously I'm a big fan of Ferland's, so he would have been my first choice. But the knee injury needs a rehab, and that rehab won't be here. Street deserves to be here. So does Grandlund. And Knight. And probably Reinhart. Particularly if Byron's here (and Byron's earning his keep). I'd like to see what Wotherspoon could/would do at this level, but Cundari and the others (Hanowski, too) who need a look before being offered contracts makes absolute business sense. And MacDermid has more upside than Westgarth and McGrattan. I think he's got more game than others may think. Here's hoping!

As for goalies, none have impressed me to the level they've impressed some of you. Ramo and Berra are backups, in my opinion. And journeymen backups. That's simply how I see it. We better hope Gillies is for real. Ortio may be a sleeper. Let's hope so. With Burke here, the rebuild won't be tolerated too much longer. He'll want playoff hockey. Not a bad thing. Who doesn't? So he may move assets to get a goalie with a more proven track record in the league. I have no one in mind here, just thinking "Burke". Some have mentioned Reimer. "Perhaps"...

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#9 beloch
January 10 2014, 04:07PM
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Some random observations:

1. Cap Space: The Flames have $20M of it sitting unused this season and everybody in the org seems to be happy to point out how awesome the ownership is for being willing to spend to the cap every year, provided it helps the team. It's time to prove it. Unused cap space does not carry forward. The Flames gave up a lot to get this precious resource. Don't squander it! There are negative value contracts out there that can be brought on board with picks and prospects. Every time you watch the Flames get their heads bashed in this season, remember that this is, in large part, because the team spent less on their players than all but three other teams in the league! Freeing up cap space is admirable if you use it strategically to improve the team. Squandering cap space is just being cheap, and there's no excuse for being cheap in a hockey market like Calgary!

2. Goons: There's no doubt that superior players to McGrattan and Westgarth are currently toiling away in Abbotsford. I too do not see any reason to dress both these guys nightly, except one, and it's a doozy: Player development. We're beginning to see some fresh lessons in what can happen when players are rushed into the NHL before they're ready. Some might rise to the challenge while others seem to get their heads messed up. If staying in the AHL is better for a quality prospect's long-term development, then two dancing bears per Flames game it shall be!

3. Hiring a new GM: Why are the owners letting Burke do this? At most, I'd let him recommend some, not all, of the candidates. If I were one of the owners I would not allow Burke to hire an assistant GM and then call him a GM. If you do this, you're not getting a president of hockey operations and a general manager. You're getting a GM and an assistant GM, and overpaying for them both! The flames ownership, not Burke, should be hiring a real GM who will take Burke's advice when it's good and fight tooth-and-nail to get his own way when he's convinced Burke isn't right. They should be looking for Burke's future replacement, just as if Burke was GM!

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#10 coachedpotatoe
January 10 2014, 04:36PM
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1. The season has gone pretty much as I expected it would with two exceptions; the number of injuries to key people has had a cumulative impact on the team a little earlier than I expected and I had hoped to see the debut of some of the prospects for at least a couple games by now.

2. Like many I believe Burke will hire a former staff person who will act as a yes man and fall guy if Burkes plan fails.

3. Personally I would like to see a lot of young guys called up after the trade deadline not all at once mind you. We would have 19 games after the trade deadline and I would to see the following heat players all be given 4-6 games over that period: Knight, Granlund,Rhino, Street, Hankowski, Sven and Ferland if he is healthy and has had a good month back with the Heat. I would also like to see each of them get a couple of games before then, Heck I would also be good with seeing Mcdermid ahead McG and westgarth. Hopefully there will also be room for the NCCA grad to see some action;Arnold and agostino and hopefully Johny G. On the backend assuming Butler is traded I would like to see Billins, Cundai and Ramage as I doubt Spoon is as ready and even if Sieloff is back he needs games at the AHL level. I would also be very straight forward with them and let them know it is a 5/6 game taste and they will be going back to the Heat. Hopefully when they go back to Abby they can have along playoff run.

Also we should be listening to are at least following the BC/Providence game tonight as two/three of our top prospects are playing each other.

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#11 SB
January 10 2014, 07:28PM
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Some good answers to important questions that need to be addressed in the near future.

goaltending may be easy decision unless you want totrade one as an assess.

GM selection does not matter as BB will berunning it.

BB will trade the guys he dos not like and play the season out with the guys he does like. ( they are mainly all third and fourth line talent anyway )

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#12 MontanaMan
January 10 2014, 08:47PM
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Couple of random thoughts:

1. Two parts to the GM search: 1) A GM that Burke wants; and 2) A GM that wants to work with Burke. Important distinction as there will be a number of quality GM's or AGM's looking to get a shot at running a team but candidates will be very wary about working under a dictator like Burke. The result is that the Flames may not get the best GM due to "fit".

2. I could care less whether most of the vets were shipped out. Guys like Cammy are indifferent and playing like they want to be traded. Others like Stajan, Butler, Stemp are lightweights and not worth minimum salary. What a brutal position to be in when you need to keep overpaid stiffs to make the cap floor.

3. Drafting - acknowledging there were changes with the scouting department under Feaster, but how does Button continue to head this group after 4(?) GM's, countless coaches and how many unsuccessful drafts? I can't believe that Burke or the new GM will keep Button. Scouting and drafting needs to change desperately. Check out teams that consistently finish much higher than Calgary (thus worse picks) like Boston or Detroit who year after year draft well. Calgary not so much.

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#13 cunning_linguist
January 10 2014, 02:04PM
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Somebody told me that Kipper is currently playing forward for a beer league hockey team in Black Diamond. Let's give him a shot.

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#14 beloch
January 10 2014, 08:14PM
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Purple Hazze wrote:

Cap space as an asset seems to be fools gold. No team is going to give up assets for cap relief, this couldn't have been more evident last summer with a lot of team pushed up against a falling cap. Yet, teams found a way to get under the cap without having to give up assets, and with a rising cap in the future this will only get easier for teams.

It's one thing to avoid giving up long-term assets for short-term gain when you have a full season ahead of you and have no idea how it's going to turn out. It's quite another thing at the trade deadline. Teams who think they have a shot at the cup do stupid things to tip the scales in their favor. At the very least, keep Cammalleri, etc.'s salary on Calgary's books and demand extra return.

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#15 SeanCharles
January 10 2014, 11:20AM
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- We are a team constructed of no elite talent, 2-3 top-6 forwards (Hudler, Cammalleri, Glencross), a bunch of 3rd liners, with some 4th liners sprinkled in. Struggles were inevitable.

- No, I have always supported Hartley as coach. I haven't always supported his decisions but in the long run I think his eye was on proper player development so I can forgive him. People need to realize that even though Hartley has a say, the GM is the one who has the final word on who is recalled/demoted. You can't cr@p on Hartley for playing two enforcers, or not playing guys in ABBY when he doesn't do the recalls. He is given players and he does his best with what he is given. Considering the roster we have he has done well. We have an identity under him, something we have lacked for many years...

- I think you keep Ramo, Berra and Ortio so long as you don't seek a true #1 in the offseason. Roy I don't care either way, if Gillies is signed maybe Roy shouldnt be. Ramo and Berra have shown progression at the NHL level so it might be worth keeping them. Ortio is obviously going to be given an opportunity as he and Gillies are the future.

- I'm not going to pretend to I have an answer for this. I have no clue who I would hire. I don't know enough about any of the candidates. If I were to guess I would say Jim Benning.

- Give players like Granlund, Knight, Reinhart and possibly Baertschi the call. Street is probably an option to make a full 23 man roster. On the backend probably Cundari and Billins. I think Ramage, Wotherspoon and Sieloff may get a look but considering they are all first year pros there is not rush to play them a ton at the NHL level. Let them see what they need to work on in the NHL and then, hopefully, make some noise in the AHL playoffs.

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#16 Derzie
January 10 2014, 12:26PM
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I love hockey and only know what is a good (e.g. St Louis) or bad team (e.g. Calgary), not how to get from bad to good. I would be really interested to look at a team like St Louis. Roll back the clock 5 years and look at where the current roster was then in their individual development. What were their ceilings? Vets vs. rookies. Did they overachieve? Did they reach their ceiling with St Louis or prior? What is their pedigree (AHL, CHL, Europe, College)? What was the ratio of vets to rookies over the 5 years? How did depth by position evolve. What role did coaching personnel play? When was the right time to bring in a coach? I hate where we are (expected) but do not know what progress to a better place looks like. It's easy to pick the carcass right now but I have no idea if Hartley is what we need at this time or in year 2, 3 etc.

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#17 SeanCharles
January 10 2014, 01:34PM
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@MonsterPod

"Keep Gio and Monahan -- burn the rest down."

Brodie, Russell, Smid, Bouma, Colbrone all provide a certain element to the team that I think is important. Colborne and Bouma have spent the majority of the season outside of the top 9 so I don't know if they can be blamed for offensive woes..They are young and can at least be 4th line players. Wideman being our only right hand shot makes it difficult to move on from.

Point being I don't think our 4th liners and defense is what is wrong with the team..

Our top 9 is weak and you may be right, Monahan may be the only player left, in that group, when our rebuild is complete.

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#18 Skuehler
January 10 2014, 06:22PM
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everton fc wrote:

Good article. Covered a lot of ground.

My feelings:

I like Botterill. I like Fenton (who doesn't?) Hextall will never leave Philly. But we probably get someone Burke's worked with, in the past. Typical of recent moves here in Calgary.

Hartley's probably done the best he could with the spare parts and also-rans he's been tasked with. Work ethic matters. A better roster than the expansion-level group we currently have here would be a possible playoff contender (albeit 6-8 spot). But I don't think he's around next season, for he's not Burke's man.

Farm hands I'd like to see up here:

Obviously I'm a big fan of Ferland's, so he would have been my first choice. But the knee injury needs a rehab, and that rehab won't be here. Street deserves to be here. So does Grandlund. And Knight. And probably Reinhart. Particularly if Byron's here (and Byron's earning his keep). I'd like to see what Wotherspoon could/would do at this level, but Cundari and the others (Hanowski, too) who need a look before being offered contracts makes absolute business sense. And MacDermid has more upside than Westgarth and McGrattan. I think he's got more game than others may think. Here's hoping!

As for goalies, none have impressed me to the level they've impressed some of you. Ramo and Berra are backups, in my opinion. And journeymen backups. That's simply how I see it. We better hope Gillies is for real. Ortio may be a sleeper. Let's hope so. With Burke here, the rebuild won't be tolerated too much longer. He'll want playoff hockey. Not a bad thing. Who doesn't? So he may move assets to get a goalie with a more proven track record in the league. I have no one in mind here, just thinking "Burke". Some have mentioned Reimer. "Perhaps"...

I totally see Burke starting with cornerstone brand name players at goal, defence, and a sniper or power forward. Seems like his MO.

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#19 SeanCharles
January 10 2014, 02:20PM
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cunning_linguist wrote:

Somebody told me that Kipper is currently playing forward for a beer league hockey team in Black Diamond. Let's give him a shot.

I can verify this. I work with Bob "The Bearcat" Murray's son who informed me of this a couple months ago..

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#20 Purple Hazze
January 10 2014, 05:26PM
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@beloch

Cap space as an asset seems to be fools gold. No team is going to give up assets for cap relief, this couldn't have been more evident last summer with a lot of team pushed up against a falling cap. Yet, teams found a way to get under the cap without having to give up assets, and with a rising cap in the future this will only get easier for teams.

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#21 FlamesRule
January 10 2014, 11:46PM
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Work ethic - this is what hooked me and made me a Flames fan all those years ago. Anything that's done personnel-wise over the next while cannot be to the detriment of this.

Hartley - he is a big reason behind this work ethic and should be allowed to see it through to fruition.

Goalies - keep them all and let Gillies outplay them for a spot after he's signed - if he doesn't , start replacing them through trade or free agency with better players.

GM - Byron is bang on.

Call-ups - the Bees - Baertschi, Billins, Breen and corBan

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#22 RexLibris
January 11 2014, 11:49AM
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Looking over some shooting percentages this morning and came across this gem:

The Flames winning percentage when they are being outshot is .444. Their winning percentage when they are outshooting the opposition is .133.

The next worse team is Buffalo with a winning % when outshooting of .222 and they are about 27 goals behind in scoring for.

That number is obviously heavily influenced by the Flames' recent goal-drought, but nevertheless I don't think I've ever seen a positive possession number linked so horrifically to a winning %.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/teamstats.htm?fetchKey=20142ALLSAAAll&sort=wins&viewName=summary

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#23 Baalzamon
January 11 2014, 12:41PM
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@RexLibris

Score effects coming into effect in a big way, I suppose. Still. Weird.

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#24 BJ
January 11 2014, 10:24PM
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What about bringing up ajon aramage... he is a steady type of player that would be good as a #6

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