Trade Deadline: What Do the Flames Have? What Can They Get?

Ryan Pike
February 05 2014 03:30PM

It's an off-day today and the hockey world is a bit quiet. Since the trade deadline is coming up fast after the Olympic Break, I thought it might be prudent to take a look at what the Flames have in their cupboards that other teams may want.

As you may expect, what the Flames move and what they get back may depend on how desperate other teams are for positional depth.

GOALIES

  • Karri Ramo is the only goalie in the organization signed for next year. I doubt he'd be moved, but he's a perfectly acceptable back-up on just about every NHL club. That's worth maybe a third rounder.
  • Reto Berra is a back-up right now on a bottom-five NHL team. He's still adjusting to the NHL game, and will probably get gradually better. He's a UFA this summer. I also doubt he's moved, but you get a mid-to-late round pick for him.
  • Joni Ortio is a pending RFA. He's an unknown quantity at the NHL level but really good at the AHL level. No clue where his value shakes out.
  • Joey MacDonald went through waivers and nobody took him, but at least he has some NHL experience. His trade value is maybe a sixth or seventh rounder, if that. He's a UFA in July.
  • Olivier Roy is an AHL back-up. He has very little trade value. He's an RFA.
  • Jon Gillies is unsigned. He's a pretty tantalizing asset, though, and there's a chance you can get a team to overpay based on potential. His stock may have taken a bit of a hit after Team USA's sub-par World Juniors and his minor struggles in the NCAA afterwards.

DEFENSEMEN

  • Dennis Wideman is signed long-term, but his cap hit pretty big for what he is. He's a solid 3/4 defender and useful on the power-play, but he's not amazing five-on-five. To move him you probably need to keep some salary.
  • Mark Giordano is relatively inexpensive and is a perfectly solid 3/4 defender. There's no damn way they trade him, as he's the heart and soul of their team, and signed long-term.
  • Ladislav Smid is a fine 5/6 defender but he's paid like a second-pairing guy. He's a solid penalty-kill option but isn't fantastic at even-strength. He's a depth option for a team that wants a defender but balks at Wideman's cost.
  • T.J. Brodie is a rapidly improving young blueliner. He's a pretty good first pairing guy who is currently paid like a bottom-pairing guy. You can probably get a good asset for Brodie, but then you'd have to be sure they'll turn out better than he will. No chance he's moved.
  • Chris Butler is an inexpensive 5/6 defenseman who can fill in anywhere and not be horrible. He's underrated in the sense that he eats up penalty-kill time so that the team's skill defensemen can play more at crunch time. For a team with depth, he could be a decent 5/6/7 option. Pending UFA.
  • I'm of two minds about Kris Russell. He's small. He's inexpensive. He's gotten great situational minutes in Calgary, including a lot of PP time. But he can get knocked off the puck easily. He's a 3/4 guy in Calgary, but probably a 5/6 guy who's a power-play specialist elsewhere. If Calgary can't get a deal worked out with him – and word is they're close – they can easily recoup their fourth round pick investment.
  • Chris Breen is a pending RFA. He's big. He's a good AHL defender. He hasn't shown much of anything at the NHL level, though.
  • Chad Billins is a pending RFA. He's small. He's moble. He's a good AHL defender who was fine when he was up in Calgary. He's a replacement-level NHLer at this point.
  • Derek Smith is a pending UFA. He's got decent size and is a fine filler body, but he's probably an AHLer in most organizations. He's Chad Billins, except slightly bigger and with NHL experience. He's dirt-cheap but cleared waivers, which is probably an indication of his trade value.
  • Tyler Wotherspoon has a couple years left on his entry-level deal. He's a 3/4 guy in Abbotsford who's projecting as a perfectly fine shut-down defender.
  • John Ramage has little offensive upside, but he's been fine in the AHL. He's still a bit of a project, in terms of his mobility and his transition game.
  • Pat Sieloff has played two games. He's basically an unknown quantity in the AHL, but given his physicality, I doubt he's moved.
  • Mark Cundari was sent to the Chicago Wolves and James Martin has spent most of his entry-level deal in the ECHL. Both are RFAs. Both have very little trade value.
  • Keegan Kanzig, Eric Roy, Ryan Culkin and Brett Kulak are the junior defenders. John Gilmour is the lone college blueliner. They probably all have some trade value, but it's all based on perceived pro potential. If a team's scouts fall in love with one of them, you can probably get an asset back.
  • The rights to Russian junior Rushan Rafikov are probably worth very, very little in the grand scheme of things.

FORWARDS

  • Mike Cammalleri is a top-six player in Calgary, but his position on other teams is probably second or third line. He's got speed to burn, but he's been criticized at times for his defensive play. He's incredibly useful on the power-play, as his one-timers from the right side are deadly. His health may be a concern – he missed time with a broken hand and a concussion this year – but he can definitely be a weapon for a team on the hunt. His cap hit is a bit high, though, and he's a pending UFA. Both will possibly drive the asking price down a bit.
  • Jiri Hudler is a top-six guy here who is probably a second/third liner elsewhere. Hudler's almost criminally underrated, in that he operates with a quiet two-way game, but occasionally springs his line-mates for offensive opportunities. I don't think he has the speed to be a deadly top-six player, but he's an excellent complementary guy. He's signed long-term. He's valuable here, but may also be a guy teams call about.
  • David Jones is a third liner on most teams. His cap hit may be a tad high for what he brings to the table, but he's got size and can play in most situations.
  • Matt Stajan just got signed long-term for a pretty decent cap hit. He's likely not moving now, but he's a decent tough-minutes center who's a good veteran mentor for Calgary's many, many young pivots.
  • Curtis Glencross has a no-movement deal and a really good cap hit. He's been injured quite a bit this year, but he's a good complementary winger who can slot in basically anywhere on your top nine. He won't be moving this year, but he probably wasn't going to be moved anyway.
  • Lee Stempniak is basically a right-wing version of Glencross. He's got less offensive upside, but he can eat the tough minutes, he can slot in more or less anywhere and he plays in every situation. He's also a pending UFA. He's been injured this season and took awhile to get back into the swing of things when he jumped back into the line-up. You probably get a bottom-six guy or a draft pick of some sort if you have a motivated buyer.
  • Mikael Backlund has another year left with a low cap hit. Right now, he's a second-line center with some upside. His recent offensive outbursts may not have driven his value up, as it's unclear if this is Mikael's "new normal" or merely a hot streak. But Backlund has played on all four lines, can play in every situation and can distribute the puck or finish, depending on his linemates. If the Flames decide that with the Stajan signing, they're set for "tough minutes" guys for awhile, Backlund could fetch a decent return, although his injury history (and his offensive upside) may drive the return down.
  • T.J. Galiardi is a third liner right now, maybe a fourth liner on some teams. He's a pending RFA, but is also pretty inexpensive and has shown the ability to be thrown in most areas of the line-up in a pinch.
  • Sean Monahan will not be moved. He's a solid second/third-line pivot right now with some upside. His defensive game needs a bit of rounding out, but he's been extremely solid offensively, especially for playing on the third line.
  • Brian McGrattan and Kevin Westgarth are basically the same player. They have low offensive upside but are considered good intangibles guys - they're good in the room and are big guys that can fight. Their trade value isn't high. McGrattan is signed for next year, Westgarth is a pending UFA.
  • Lance Bouma is the lowest paid Calgary Flames player. He's a pending RFA. I'd be shocked if they haven't called his agent by now to talk turkey. He's a great PK guy and shot-blocker and he's likely a career third/fourth line guy. I can't see them trading him, although I bet they're getting calls.
  • Joe Colborne is still a work in progress. He's a pending RFA. He's big and he's now being used as a center and occasional winger. The trouble for him is he's not physical enough yet to be an effective bottom-six center, nor is he offensively skilled enough to play top six minutes. Not sure what his value is.
  • Paul Byron is a pending RFA. He's small, but he's played with a physical edge this season, which is probably why he's still up on the NHL roster. That said, with so many bigger guys coming up in the system, I'm not sure where Byron fits in. Not sure what is trade value is, either.
  • Corban Knight is a big-bodied center with some upside. He's signed for another year. He's been one of the Heat's better players. I can't see the Flames moving him, although I can see teams being interested. Troy Ward is trying him out as a winger to round out his game, and give him more opportunities to make the NHL.
  • Sven Baertschi is an interesting case. He's got one more year left on his entry-level deal. He hasn't been amazing with the Flames or the Heat this season. He's small and not amazing in all three zones, but he's got great offensive talent, at least in the minors. I can see the Flames cutting bait and moving him for another team's "problem child" prospect, or they could be more patient - which seems to be Brian Burke's way - and let him work things out over time. My gut says he sticks in this organization.
  • Ben Street and Blair Jones are both similar. They're both pending UFAs and replacement-level NHLers. You could trade them, but every team probably has one or two tweener forwards bouncing between the AHL and NHL. Neither got claimed on waivers despite being inexpensive.
  • Lane MacDermid is a pending RFA. He's got size and physicality, but I'm not sure if he brings much else to the table. He may get signed, he may walk and he may get flipped for a sixth rounder again. No clue.
  • Josh Jooris has another year left and has been a complementary guy in the AHL. He's a two-way guy without a lot of offense in his game.
  • Ben Hanowski is a pending RFA. He's got decent size but not great skating. He's been decent in his first year of pro and his offensive numbers aren't terrible. He likely gets re-upped. I'm not sure what trade value he has right now.
  • Max Reinhart doesn't have a huge frame, but his offensive game has really improved with the Heat this year. He plays a solid two-way game and can play in every situation. He won't get much bigger, but he's a very smart player on both sides of the puck. He's probably got more trade value than Roman Horak had, but not a heck of a lot more.
  • Markus Granlund has progressed from an untried rookie into a solid offensive contributor in Abbotsford. He's got a decent frame and can muck around in the dirty areas. I'm not sure what he is at the NHL level, but he's probably also not finished developing at the AHL level yet, either.
  • Michael Ferland is my pick to be the next Lance Bouma. He's got size and drives the net, but he may lack the offensive vision to become a high-end scorer as a pro. But he's adept at creating space for his teammates. His knee injury this season may drive his future trade value down, but I seriously doubt he gets traded. He's got another year left on his entry-level deal.
  • Turner Elson is a bottom-six guy in Abbotsford and just got sent to the ECHL for playing time. He's got another year left on his deal. He has low asset value right now.
  • David Eddy has spent his entry-level deal primarily in the ECHL. He has very low asset value.
  • Johnny Gaudreau is unsigned and the Flames probably get many calls asking about him. I really doubt they do anything but sign him in March or April. The Flames probably get calls about Bill Arnold, too, but I also imagine he gets signed. Not sure how many calls they get about Kenny Agostino, but he also probably gets signed. The Flames probably get zero calls about Matt Deblouw and Tim Harrison. They both have many years of school remaining and Deblouw has been scratched a lot lately. Mark Jankowski remains a project and I don't know how other teams valuate him.
  • Emile Poirier & Morgan Klimchuk are already signed juniors. Coda Gordon is an unsigned junior. I doubt any of the three of them get traded.

SUM IT UP

  • Most Likely To Be Traded: Mike Cammalleri, Lee Stempniak,
  • Dark Horses: Chris Butler, Jiri Hudler
  • Teams Call About: Kris Russell, Johnny Gaudreau, Mikael Backlund
  • They Wished Teams Called About: Dennis Wideman

The NHL's trade deadline is Wednesday, March 5. We'll be all over it from start to finish.

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Ryan Pike is a Calgary native and FlamesNation's managing editor. He's covered the Flames and the NHL since 2010. His work can also be found at The Hockey Writers and The Wrestling Observer.
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#1 Stan
February 05 2014, 04:18PM
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Agree with most of this... however I can't help but laugh when you state Giordano as "solid 3/4 defender". With the way Gio has played this season, he is a "solid top pairing defender". Hands down, no questions asked.

Also laughed at the description of monahan as a "solid second/third-line pivot with some upside". Monahan has a LOT more then just "some upside". Kid has the potential to be a first line center, or a great second line center.

I also disagree with the assessment of Russell.

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#3 JayD54
February 05 2014, 04:25PM
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I may quibble with some of your valuations or your questions, but the Sum It Up is exactly parallel to mine.

I think that all 3 of the players Teams Call About will be here next year, particularly if Gaudreau wins the Hobey Baker.

Think a bigger question is, if you assume that the Flames make moves ahead of the deadline, which Heat guys get promoted? I would like to see Reinhart, Knight and Granlund from the forward ranks, Wotherspoon would be my pick from defence. Hopefully, Ortio gets the start Thursday versus the Islanders or Saturday against Philly and we can get a glimpse of his NHL-worthiness.

As for the NCAA seniors, Bill Arnold and Kenny Agostino get inked. If they are out of the Frozen Four before the end of the season, we might see one or both in Flames silks this season. With regards to the underclassmen, I hope Gillies stays in NCAA for at least another (junior) year. The rest should finish their respective eligibility.

In my opinion, those graduating, unsigned Juniors who warrant a pro look see are Culkin (saw him at the rookie tourney in Penticton and liked what I saw) and Gordon. Kulak is a tough call in that he has played--and been a leader--on a miserable Giants squad the past couple years.

With a whack of cap space and a number of expiring contracts (both RFA and UFA) this year, the Flames will have a lot of flexibility to be picky and particular this off season. That should be an asset on a re-building squad.

New Jersey forfeits their first round pick this year because of the Ilya Kovalchuk shenanigans which means there are only 29 picks in the first round. In this draft year, that probably does not impact as much as, say, last year when there were more higher ranked players. But it does raise the value of the picks of the teams finishing just ahead of the Devils (at the moment Nashville, Carolina and Washington)! I do not expect the Flames to be able to move prospects or even a roster player (short of Monahan, Giordano) to get another slot in round 1.

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#4 Bean-counting cowboy
February 05 2014, 04:32PM
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JayD54 wrote:

I may quibble with some of your valuations or your questions, but the Sum It Up is exactly parallel to mine.

I think that all 3 of the players Teams Call About will be here next year, particularly if Gaudreau wins the Hobey Baker.

Think a bigger question is, if you assume that the Flames make moves ahead of the deadline, which Heat guys get promoted? I would like to see Reinhart, Knight and Granlund from the forward ranks, Wotherspoon would be my pick from defence. Hopefully, Ortio gets the start Thursday versus the Islanders or Saturday against Philly and we can get a glimpse of his NHL-worthiness.

As for the NCAA seniors, Bill Arnold and Kenny Agostino get inked. If they are out of the Frozen Four before the end of the season, we might see one or both in Flames silks this season. With regards to the underclassmen, I hope Gillies stays in NCAA for at least another (junior) year. The rest should finish their respective eligibility.

In my opinion, those graduating, unsigned Juniors who warrant a pro look see are Culkin (saw him at the rookie tourney in Penticton and liked what I saw) and Gordon. Kulak is a tough call in that he has played--and been a leader--on a miserable Giants squad the past couple years.

With a whack of cap space and a number of expiring contracts (both RFA and UFA) this year, the Flames will have a lot of flexibility to be picky and particular this off season. That should be an asset on a re-building squad.

New Jersey forfeits their first round pick this year because of the Ilya Kovalchuk shenanigans which means there are only 29 picks in the first round. In this draft year, that probably does not impact as much as, say, last year when there were more higher ranked players. But it does raise the value of the picks of the teams finishing just ahead of the Devils (at the moment Nashville, Carolina and Washington)! I do not expect the Flames to be able to move prospects or even a roster player (short of Monahan, Giordano) to get another slot in round 1.

I think we see Billins or Smith before Wotherspoon if any of our D get traded. I don't mind him staying with the heat all year.

I think you may get a 1st out of Cammalleri if we eat the max salary (50%) from a team that tried but missed out on Vanek, Moulson, Callahan, etc.

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#6 Stan
February 05 2014, 04:34PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

Giordano's a 3/4 guy on a team with depth. If he's sent to St. Louis or LA, he's second pairing.

Those are two of the best defensive teams in the league... Currently ranked third and first in goals against per game (respectively). If your going to say that he is a solid 3/4 defensemen on the deepest defensive team in the league, then thats one thing, but to evaluate him as just a solid 3/4 defenseman overall is completely different. For example, thats like saying that Jamie Benn is a "solid 3rd line center" just because he would be the third line center if he were playing on the penguins. Ridiculous.

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#7 Lordmork
February 05 2014, 04:48PM
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I have to say, from the talk earlier this year, I had it in my head that some of our pending UFA's might get us a much higher return than what's been suggested here. Is that a case of their play having pulled back a bit since then, or simply a case of overvaluing our players?

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#8 KingQuong
February 05 2014, 04:49PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

Giordano's a 3/4 guy on a team with depth. If he's sent to St. Louis or LA, he's second pairing.

I disagree with the 3/4 guy also especially if the stuff about him being the first left handed shot dman yzerman will call up if there's an injury is true.

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#9 Bean-counting cowboy
February 05 2014, 04:51PM
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For next year:

Sign - Arnold - Agostino - Gaudreau - Culkin - Gordon - Roy - Ortio - Berra (for Abby) - Billins - Hanowski - Byron - Bouma - Colbourne - Russell - Stempniak (if he wants, if not trade)

Let walk (if can't trade) - Cundari - Martin - Elson - Eddy - MacDermid - Westgarth - MacDonald - Smith - Street - Jones - Breen

Trade - Galiardi - Camalleri - Butler

Buyout - O'Brien

Let "marinate" - Gillies - Janko

Entertain offers on everyone else, except - Monahan - Brodie - Backlund - Bouma - Glencross - Giordano

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#10 sb
February 05 2014, 04:51PM
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What would you really get for Lee Stempniak?? He is a power forward which they need and other then if the flames got a second round pick for him you are trading a dollar for a dollar. Sign him to a home town discount if he wants to stay.

If Cammi can get a first or second round pick then go for it.

Butler and Russell should be signed as they fit into the needs of the club on D

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#11 Bean-counting cowboy
February 05 2014, 05:01PM
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Lordmork wrote:

I have to say, from the talk earlier this year, I had it in my head that some of our pending UFA's might get us a much higher return than what's been suggested here. Is that a case of their play having pulled back a bit since then, or simply a case of overvaluing our players?

I think the new low cap is playing into this. Too many teams are just too up against it.

When you think to last year where Calgary and Columbus had 3 1st round picks, Buffalo 2, etc. there sure wasn't a reluctance to trade 1st rounders last year.

When Paul Gaustad fetches a 1st and Douglas Murray gets 2 2nd's, you'd think we be able to get a 1st for Cammy if we at half the salary, but maybe the cap is going to mess that up for us.

In my mind, a 31 year old Camalleri at 6 mil should get close to an Iginla at 7 mil and 36 years old. However as suggested with injury concerns, the new cap, maybe not anymore.

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#12 coachedpotatoe
February 05 2014, 05:03PM
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@Bean-counting cowboy

Hudler?

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#13 Bean-counting cowboy
February 05 2014, 05:11PM
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coachedpotatoe wrote:

Hudler?

He falls into the "everyone else" category. I Didn't list anyone already under contract who I didn't specifically list in any other category.

For Hudler, you keep, but entertain any offer that comes your way.

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#14 SmellOfVictory
February 05 2014, 05:13PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

Giordano's a 3/4 guy on a team with depth. If he's sent to St. Louis or LA, he's second pairing.

He's not a 3/4 guy on a team with depth. He's a 2/3 guy on one of those teams. I can't think of a single team where he'd be considered the 4th defenceman. If Gio's not on the top pairing, he's anchoring whichever pair he's on. I can also name a good number of teams where he'd be the #1 dman.

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#16 WaIter White
February 05 2014, 05:28PM
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Hate to say it, but honestly, the best thing might be to trade Monahan right now. Everyone in the NHL thinks he's got 1st line center/star player potential. He's still riding the wave of his first month as a rookie, a wave which he has definitely come down from. For us, best case scenario is that he turns out to be what he's valued at. Worst case scenario, he settles into a 3rd line or so type of role and his trade value goes down from what it is right now. If you want to accelerate this rebuild, you gotta make the tough calls. Mony's a former 6th overall, probably gets you a top 5 pick and a prospect as it stands right now. Personally, I'd rather have an Aaron Ekblad and a Billy Jacobs than a Monahan.

WW

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#17 Karimeeloranta
February 05 2014, 05:37PM
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You are saying Brodie is already a better D-man than Giordano? That is crazy talk.

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#18 Bean-counting cowboy
February 05 2014, 05:42PM
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WaIter White wrote:

Hate to say it, but honestly, the best thing might be to trade Monahan right now. Everyone in the NHL thinks he's got 1st line center/star player potential. He's still riding the wave of his first month as a rookie, a wave which he has definitely come down from. For us, best case scenario is that he turns out to be what he's valued at. Worst case scenario, he settles into a 3rd line or so type of role and his trade value goes down from what it is right now. If you want to accelerate this rebuild, you gotta make the tough calls. Mony's a former 6th overall, probably gets you a top 5 pick and a prospect as it stands right now. Personally, I'd rather have an Aaron Ekblad and a Billy Jacobs than a Monahan.

WW

So glad you're not running my team. Is this satire? I never know with you sometimes.

You would trade a (likely) 20 goal scoring 19 year old rookie with size, hockey sense and a nose for the net for Ekblad and who? Ekblad is not necessarily the "generational talent" many are making him out to be. Many think Nurse (drafted after Monahan) will be the better player. Besides what would be the point? Trading a forward for a defenceman when neither of their potential is a certainty?

Monahan could end up being Getzlaf 2.0. Ekblad could be Jack Johnson. If you made this move and that ended up being their eventual upside, you would be crucified by the fanbase. If you made no such trade, there is absolutely no risk.

Foolishness and heresy. I usually never call someone out on this site, but don't be an idiot WW.

BCC

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#19 BurningSensation
February 05 2014, 05:51PM
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WaIter White wrote:

Hate to say it, but honestly, the best thing might be to trade Monahan right now. Everyone in the NHL thinks he's got 1st line center/star player potential. He's still riding the wave of his first month as a rookie, a wave which he has definitely come down from. For us, best case scenario is that he turns out to be what he's valued at. Worst case scenario, he settles into a 3rd line or so type of role and his trade value goes down from what it is right now. If you want to accelerate this rebuild, you gotta make the tough calls. Mony's a former 6th overall, probably gets you a top 5 pick and a prospect as it stands right now. Personally, I'd rather have an Aaron Ekblad and a Billy Jacobs than a Monahan.

WW

You are way overthinking things if you believe we should trade Monahan.

Monahan represents one of the single most difficult things to acquire - a young, offensively minded center, with size, and defensive ability, and on his ELC.

Getting back a top 5 pick (especially in a weak draft) and a 'prospect' for him is exceedingly dumb. Why? Because you have to hope that the player you take with the top 5 pick is as good as Monahan (I don't see it, Monahan was among the top C's available in his draft year - and it was an awesome draft year, he compares to a top 3 pick in most years), and you lose all the time you have already invested in Monahan.

In this case, two birds of unknown value are NOT worth the bird in the hand.

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#20 Kypreos
February 05 2014, 05:59PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

The cap is huge right now in dissuading teams from adding much salary at the deadline. Also big is that virtually everyone teams would be calling about has been hurt this year. It's hard to sell high if the first question they ask is "How's his knee?" or "How's his head?"

If teams parted with a first round pick last year in "the deepest draft in years", I can teams doing it this year. Prospect pool is not great.

Cammy should fetch a first with the flames taking back salary or eating some of his.

Stempniak a 2nd rounder.

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#21 BurningSensation
February 05 2014, 06:04PM
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Kypreos wrote:

If teams parted with a first round pick last year in "the deepest draft in years", I can teams doing it this year. Prospect pool is not great.

Cammy should fetch a first with the flames taking back salary or eating some of his.

Stempniak a 2nd rounder.

Honestly, given the lack of interest from teams to 'eat salary' as part of making a trade, I doubt that the Flames will do so. They didn't with J-Bo (when it would have really helped) or Iginla, so I doubt we will with Cammalleri.

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#22 Kypreos
February 05 2014, 06:18PM
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BurningSensation wrote:

Honestly, given the lack of interest from teams to 'eat salary' as part of making a trade, I doubt that the Flames will do so. They didn't with J-Bo (when it would have really helped) or Iginla, so I doubt we will with Cammalleri.

Ah They did not have to eat salary last year???

They got a first for both Iginla and JBO.....

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#23 BurningSensation
February 05 2014, 06:37PM
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Kypreos wrote:

Ah They did not have to eat salary last year???

They got a first for both Iginla and JBO.....

Nope, none of the deals made last year involved the Flames keeping any salary.

Yes, Iggy and J-Bo brought us back 1st rnd picks, but Cammalleri is not a HOF top 6 winger or a top pairing D-man, so I doubt that the Flames get anything higher than the 20's as far as a returning pick.

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#24 Scary Gary
February 05 2014, 07:10PM
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I think David Jones would struggle to make a lot of third lines.

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#25 mattyc
February 05 2014, 07:35PM
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@Scary Gary

David Jones would struggle

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#26 mattyc
February 05 2014, 07:36PM
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For Giordano to be a 3/4 D man, there would have to be 60-90 Dmen better than him in the league. I'm not sure there's 30.

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#27 The Last Big Bear
February 05 2014, 07:42PM
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If I'm the GM of a contending team, I am asking about Cammalleri. And I'm expecting that my first rounder has to be on the table.

The guy is a playoff performer. I think playoff vs regular season performance differences are mostly just luck, ie guys who are "chokers" vs "clutch" in the playoffs mostly just comes down to small sample sizes.

But I think Cammalleri is one of the few who really do raise their game, even outside of his amazing point production. Which I have to re-iterate, is AMAZING.

Remember in the last Hawks-Flames series, when he was across from Martin Havlat at a faceoff, and just straight-up smashed him in the face with a butt end? Seemingly out of nowhere?

He brings a whole new level of intensity to the playoffs.

1st rounder is the starting bid. If you're not going to get a 1st or a very-well-progressing prospect for him, may as well re-sign him. He's a good player, has always been a consummate professional, and the only time he's ever caused a fuss is when he spoke out about his teammates accepting a losing culture.

If he's not going to bring back a 1st, there's no harm in keeping him, but I can't see why he wouldn't fetch that price easily.

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#28 T&A4Flames
February 05 2014, 08:04PM
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WaIter White wrote:

Hate to say it, but honestly, the best thing might be to trade Monahan right now. Everyone in the NHL thinks he's got 1st line center/star player potential. He's still riding the wave of his first month as a rookie, a wave which he has definitely come down from. For us, best case scenario is that he turns out to be what he's valued at. Worst case scenario, he settles into a 3rd line or so type of role and his trade value goes down from what it is right now. If you want to accelerate this rebuild, you gotta make the tough calls. Mony's a former 6th overall, probably gets you a top 5 pick and a prospect as it stands right now. Personally, I'd rather have an Aaron Ekblad and a Billy Jacobs than a Monahan.

WW

Go back to your drink!

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#29 Kevin R
February 05 2014, 08:16PM
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BurningSensation wrote:

Honestly, given the lack of interest from teams to 'eat salary' as part of making a trade, I doubt that the Flames will do so. They didn't with J-Bo (when it would have really helped) or Iginla, so I doubt we will with Cammalleri.

I think I have to beg to differ with you sir. Feaster was shut down by Edwards after that ROR fiasco, there was no way Edwards was trusting him to eat salary on any deal. Burke seems to have the green light to run this team & he is smart enough to use the cap space we have this year to our advantage. The window for our cap space advantage is quickly closing because the cap is going up a ton for next year. Don't be surprised Burke eats some salary or takes a bad contract back to get that 1st rounder or very good prospect back. I have a feeling some trades are going to go down where we all say whatttt???? Then okay, I like that part of it. That will be the only way to pry some extra 1st's or assets we can really get excited about back without trading something we just don't want to part with.

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#30 The real Walter White
February 05 2014, 08:16PM
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WaIter White wrote:

Hate to say it, but honestly, the best thing might be to trade Monahan right now. Everyone in the NHL thinks he's got 1st line center/star player potential. He's still riding the wave of his first month as a rookie, a wave which he has definitely come down from. For us, best case scenario is that he turns out to be what he's valued at. Worst case scenario, he settles into a 3rd line or so type of role and his trade value goes down from what it is right now. If you want to accelerate this rebuild, you gotta make the tough calls. Mony's a former 6th overall, probably gets you a top 5 pick and a prospect as it stands right now. Personally, I'd rather have an Aaron Ekblad and a Billy Jacobs than a Monahan.

WW

You knuckleheads didn't actually think that the great Walter White wrote this piece of trash???

I know immitation is the highes form of flattery, but this douch bag imposter has seen more dick ends than weekends.......what a complete ball gravy guzzler!

We all know who the real WW is!

BTW: Reihart sucks!

WW

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#31 clyde
February 05 2014, 08:23PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

Unless a buyer is really, really motivated, the Flames aren't getting another first rounder this year. They could get another second, and I can easily see them accumulating a couple thirds.

I wouldn't be so sure we can't get another 1st rounder. Jay got fleeced last year. Burke won't this year.

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#32 RexLibris
February 05 2014, 08:27PM
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Ryan,

Interesting approach to the article, listing all assets rather than just the easy, UFA ones.

I agree on Baertschi, I think Burke may (

Whoa, something wonky happened with my comment there.

I could re-write it but...nah.

Suffice to say, Cammalleri for a 2nd and a prospect like Jesse Blacker from Anaheim makes sense.

Stempniak to L.A. seems like a good fit, perhaps for a high 3rd rounder.

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#33 clyde
February 05 2014, 08:31PM
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Poirier needs to pick it up. Only got 4 goals tonight. Can't believe he didn't make the World Junior team.

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#34 Baalzamon
February 05 2014, 08:32PM
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"David Jones is a third liner on most teams"

Please. AHL teams maybe.

He isn't even a third liner here with everyone healthy.

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#36 CTibs
February 05 2014, 08:44PM
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I was planning to go to Poirer's game tonight. Missed something special.

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#38 MontanaMan
February 05 2014, 08:48PM
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Despite some good stretches this year, the Flames are going nowhere fast. They lack depth at every position, don't have a bonafide number 1 goaltender and are without a stud shutdown defenceman. With that in mind, all veterans need to be in play including Cammy, Glencross, Stempniak, Stajan, Butler, Wideman and others. That's not to say they all will be traded as they need to maintain some balance of veterans and youth and need to stay at the cap floor but all vets should potentially be in play and all offers should be considered. Only those buying in to the long range plan should remain after the deadline. All others should be shipped.

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#39 Double Dion
February 05 2014, 08:58PM
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Did you seriously just call Giordano a solid 3/4 defender and in the next line call Brodie a good top pairing guy? Do you have rocks in your head? He's been top 3/4 in the entire league this year...

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#40 Double Dion
February 05 2014, 09:01PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

Giordano's a 3/4 guy on a team with depth. If he's sent to St. Louis or LA, he's second pairing.

He's twice the player JBo is in every regard. And name another defenseman the Kings have besides Doughty who is even half the player Gio is? MAYBE second pairing in Chicago. Not on the second pair on any other team. St. Louis wanted Giordano ahead of JBo if you listened to Feasters comments.

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#41 RexLibris
February 05 2014, 09:05PM
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Ryan Pike wrote:

I've heard they're getting calls about a lot of different assets, which is why I felt doing this approach made sense.

I'd heard something similar, but I suspect some of that is that I'm not sure any of the players (even Monahan) are sacrosanct in Burke's view.

Probably more than a few tire-kickers on Backlund right now.

And for the record, I agree that Giordano is a second-pairing defender on a good team. If he is on the Blackhawks he doesn't unseat Keith-Seabrook, but he'd be something fierce with Hjalmarsson.

Same thing was said about Bouwmeester during his last two seasons, in that he was a clear #1 stud defenseman. He wasn't, but he was a very good #2 and a stellar #3 if you had the depth.

The range of #1 defensemen in the NHL is a spectrum that runs the gamut from Chara and Weber to Bieksa and Byfuglien. Many teams don't have one. I put Giordano in that spectrum but he isn't necessarily at the high end.

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#42 Parallex
February 05 2014, 09:15PM
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@Ryan Pike

They could get one (A first) for Cammy... I mean rental LW of any quality are basically him, Moulson, and Hemsky and I'd take Cammy over either of them.

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#43 Bean-counting cowboy
February 05 2014, 09:22PM
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Granlund looking very impressive

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#44 44stampede
February 05 2014, 09:29PM
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I see Dennis Wideman as a decent 3/4 guy and decent offensive upside. He plays a ton of minutes. I am assuming you are saying the Flames wish other teams would take him off our hands because he is overpaid? Not sure why he is considered largely overpaid. Maybe a bit but with the cap going up, I can see a number of lesser players getting more.

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#45 Kypreos
February 05 2014, 09:48PM
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BurningSensation wrote:

Nope, none of the deals made last year involved the Flames keeping any salary.

Yes, Iggy and J-Bo brought us back 1st rnd picks, but Cammalleri is not a HOF top 6 winger or a top pairing D-man, so I doubt that the Flames get anything higher than the 20's as far as a returning pick.

Your like arguing with my kids!

A 20's pick is a first round pick. No?

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#46 FlamesRule
February 05 2014, 09:50PM
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Ryan, great analysis. Agree with almost everything except where you rank Gio. He's top-pairing on all but maybe 5-6 teams this year (and likely the next couple few years as well).

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#47 Derzie
February 05 2014, 09:55PM
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Some serious lowballing here on our talent pool. Way too hard on the bright spots (Gio, Brodie, Monahan, Russell, Bouma, even Byron).

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#48 Jibmeister
February 05 2014, 09:58PM
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Stan wrote:

Agree with most of this... however I can't help but laugh when you state Giordano as "solid 3/4 defender". With the way Gio has played this season, he is a "solid top pairing defender". Hands down, no questions asked.

Also laughed at the description of monahan as a "solid second/third-line pivot with some upside". Monahan has a LOT more then just "some upside". Kid has the potential to be a first line center, or a great second line center.

I also disagree with the assessment of Russell.

Yep, my thoughts exactly.

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#49 ?
February 05 2014, 10:45PM
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WaIter White wrote:

Hate to say it, but honestly, the best thing might be to trade Monahan right now. Everyone in the NHL thinks he's got 1st line center/star player potential. He's still riding the wave of his first month as a rookie, a wave which he has definitely come down from. For us, best case scenario is that he turns out to be what he's valued at. Worst case scenario, he settles into a 3rd line or so type of role and his trade value goes down from what it is right now. If you want to accelerate this rebuild, you gotta make the tough calls. Mony's a former 6th overall, probably gets you a top 5 pick and a prospect as it stands right now. Personally, I'd rather have an Aaron Ekblad and a Billy Jacobs than a Monahan.

WW

This makes a ton of sense… Give up on a guy halfway through his rookie season. Genius, why hasn't Burke thought of that?

Oh, maybe it's because if he mentioned that to Edwards, ME would fire his ass?

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#50 ?
February 05 2014, 10:53PM
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@RexLibris

Hey Rex, I'm curious as to what you would be willing to trade in order to acquire Gio. Obviously it'll probably never happen as the Oilers/Flames have only ever made 2 deals with each other and both were very minor, but just as a hypothetical, what would you be willing to give up as an Oiler fan?

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