POST GAME: Serious JuJu



So here we go again.

Tonight the Flames were facing a team playing in their third game in four nights, and their back-up in net. Granted the Chicago Blackhawks are a far superior opponent than the Avalanche were, afterall, they are still one of the few to lose in regulation. However, they were coming off back to back shoot-out losses and the goal for Calgary was still the same; dominate a weary opponent, bide your time and capitalize on mistakes without giving up any.

Easy right?

The Rundown

Normally, after what happened in the Flames last outing, it would be a no-brainer to say the team needed to come out with some jump and take it to Hawks early. Not so in this case because there was a high probability that they would get burned by a team like Chicago.

Add to the fact that despite this only being Ray Emery’s second start of the year, the Flames have historically had problems getting pucks past the tender, and you have the makings for a cautious, fairly low-event first period.

And that’s exactly what we got. No scoring in the first, a powerplay for each team, and a pretty good tilt between Jackman and Bollig. Calgary out-shot Chicago 10-6 but the Hawks took the slight edge in scoring chances 4-3.

In the second period, the tempo started to pick up. The Hawks came out swinging first, dominating the Flames for the first five minutes or so by out-chancing Calgary 3-0. But the Flames weathered the early storm and the game stayed tied. For the rest of the period you could see Calgary start to put the game plan in motion. Moving their feet and subsequently moving the play down the ice, they started to generate some quality chances of their own. In fact, despite the score remaining in a scoreless tie at the end of forty, Calgary out-chanced the Hawks 6-5 while out-shooting them again 10-6.

At some point during the second intermission, someone mocked the hockey Gods so badly, that this game was only going to result in one way. Whether Joel Quenville had a voodoo doll stashed somewhere, Emery sacrificed a live chicken beneath the depths of the Saddledome, or if Patrick Kane beat someone up because they tried to offer their two cents… I don’t know.

But the only way to describe what happened next was Bad JuJu!!

The third period began with a big push by the Flames, in fact, the first quarter of the period was all Calgary. Despite that it would be the Hawks to get on the board first, when Patrick "Mr. Cab Driver" Kane" would bat a bouncing puck at Kipper. Miikka got a piece of it with his pad as he came sliding across, but not enough as the puck would trickle into the net as Kipper hugged Shaw’s stick.

To the Flames credit, they did not let the goal get them down, nor did it stem their play; if anything it amplified it.

After the goal by Kane, the Flames threw wave after wave after wave at the Hawks. They were relentless in their assaults and had Chicago reeling by the midpoint of the period. Only no one told Emery. With every wave and every assault, Emery seemed to make more and more unlikely saves. Even the announcers said, "Glencross is going to need therapy after this game!" And it was true. Curtis alone was stopped on several chances that were almost certain goals, but with Quenville’s voodoo doll and the bad juju and all… Chicago kept their lead.

FINALLY!!! At 13:23 of the third, Dennis Wideman… with the patience of Job, the nerves of a sniper, and the forethought that they just couldn’t put the puck past Emery…. Waited, waited and then put the puck in off Brent Seabrook’s skate. Whatever, we’ll take it! 1-1. It was a power play goal against a team that was 23 for 23 on the road with their PK, and it circumvented the voodoo sh…tuff, so it was all good.

Then the improbable and unimaginable happened. The high flying, goal scoring, Jay Bouwmeester joined the rush late and snapped a beauty past Emery with only 35 seconds left in regulation. Like money in the bank, 2 points were coming the Flames way; no way this one could go south right?

Yeah, well Quenville bent over and picked up his doll that he had tossed down the hall after Wideman cheated fate, and gave the little guy a jab. Bang, Marian Hossa ties the game with 2.8 seconds left on the ticker, and all Flames fans thought their tickers had just stopped.

The Flames did everything right in the third. They out-shot Chicago 24-6, 20… yes TWENTY of those shots were scoring chances (so were all 6 of the Hawks shots). They went 1 for 2 on the PP, yet were still tied and the teams were going to overtime.

The extra frame didn’t help Chicago at all, but Emery did. The Flames dominated, and I mean Dominated the Hawks in OT, out-shooting them 3-1 and out-chancing them 6-0. Emery stopped all three and on 26 different occassions, the Hawks players blocked shots from Calgary. Despite a power play for the Flames, they were going to a shoot-out. It was a travesty, it was robbery, it was unfair. Whatever you wanna call it, that’s what it was. Even CBC’s Elliotte Friedman commented on twitter… 

The shoot-out was less exciting and quite frankly predictable. Even though it was nice to see Hudler and Cervenka join Tanguay as the trio, all three were unsuccessful, while ol’ "Mr. Cab Driver" was able to tuck the puck between Kipper’s pads for the win. Game over.

Why the Flames Lost…

Been over this… Picture says a thousand words!

Red Warrior

I’m going to go with a couple of guys tonight. Sharing the honour will be Mikael Backlund and Curtis Glencross.

In the first period, Calgary’s top 2 lines had zero shots; Backs had three on his own. Once again he was flying tonight and making things happen, creating chances in the offensive zone.

His line continued to dominate in the second as Stempniak taking the lead in shots taken by Flames players.

In the third, it was the Curtis Glencross show, unfortunately minus an appearence from Scoreface. In the waves of assaults thrown at Emery, it was Glencross that should have benefitted the most. He hit the crossbar, tipped two more directly at the net and could have two more from each side of the net. All denied by Emery and the iron.

Sum it up

This is going to be a tough one for the boys to take. It’s not going to be enough to say at least they took a point away from the Chicago Blackhawks.

They dominated, they deserved the win and they were denied. But hey, it is what it is and they have to move on from this.

I’m not going to take any pot-shots tonight or assign any blame. Kipper looked miles ahead of how he played two nights ago and the defense was pretty solid holding the Hawks to 6 shots each period and then shutting them down in OT.

Despite the loss, it was clearly the best game the Flames have played this season. Many fans commenting on just how entertaining the team looks. That’s a plus isn’t it?

And DID YOU SEE THAT CRAZY PASS CERVENKA MADE FROM BETWEEN HIS LEGS??? This guy has some sick skills with the puck.

They have two days to be pissed and then get over this one. Leave it in Calgary as they now embark on a three game road trip… they don’t need the extra bagage.

Things get under way in Detroit on Tuesday. Game time is 5:30 on SNET-W

  • Imagine if we had moved Iggy and Kipper 2-3 years ago. Add 3-5 of the following players with what we have and the young prospects they would have got us. (I say up to 5 because we would have received 1st rounders to go with our high picks)
    2010- Granlund/Skinner/Gormley/Seguin
    2011 – Huberdeau/Hamilton/Baertschi/Couturier
    2012 – Galchenyuk

    I think we would be not that far away from a very good up and coming team. The Flames instead hold on to their aging stars while their value declines and the team declines.

    • Willi P

      you are preachin to the choir, i have said it for years. blow the thing up. what i notice is iggy seems to think captain means coach. he and hartley appeared to be in a confab, chit the hnic clowns picked up on it, but then said its 2 guys wanting to win. name one nhl personnell that wants to lose. personally, i think iggy isnt a leader, just the highest paid aka sundin.

    • Wasting your breath. Tired of reading comments like this. This team isn’t going to enter a rebuilding stage. Get over it. I know plenty of Oil fans who have said “enough is enough, it’s time to win.” I have no issue with this team being a competitive team every night, while injecting youth into the line up. Finishing 9th or 10th is better then 30th.

      We have lots of prospects to look forward to and the Flames have done a great job in the past few years of putting more effort into the draft and finding talent.

      1- Sven Baertschi
      2- John Gaudreau
      3- Markus Granlund
      4- Mark Jankowski
      5- Tyler Wotherspoon
      6- Pat Sieloff
      7- Jon Gillies

      Just to name a few. Stop saying we need to trade Iggy and Kipper, and blow this team up. That isn’t necessarily the answer. I really have no issue paying to go watch the Flames play and finish in 9th 10th or wherever. It’s a sport. It’s about entertainment, and it’s about winning.

      Stay the course, these games have been fun.

      • Willi P

        Totally agree.

        Iginla moves ONLY if he wants to. I think he has earned the right to choose and will be fine with his choice either way.

        I think Kipper would retire if he gets traded as well and he deserves to decide too.

        So what, the Flames have with what they have now and their future prospects.

        I am also tired of hearing about trading these two players. They have earned their right to choose and will (should) have their numbers retired. I am fine with both retiring as Flames instead of a few picks and prospects that MIGHT pan out.

      • Vintage Flame

        You are right. That list of prospects is daunting to say the least. Let’s keep holding on to what we have and enjoy this great ride we are on. Who needs to try to win?

        • Not saying I enjoy losing. If you would of read what I said it was that I want to win, hence why I don’t want this team to blow it up. This team has played a hell of a lot better than what their record shows, and I enjoy these games.

          • T&A4Flames

            If you truly want to win you need to take some risks. This team is declining. Moving Kipper and Iggy for drafts and young prospects won’t be blowing it up at all. It will be giving the franchise with one playoff series winning season in the last 23 years a reason to hope for something better.

          • If you move Iggy and Kipper, you pretty much are calling it. You’re saying losing a 30 goal scorer and a goaltender who played one of his best season of his career last year is giving us more hope? Draft picks and prospects don’t always work out.

          • T&A4Flames

            Superstar draft picks would indeed provide more hope than an old declining former star.

            I think most fans can’t relate and have no idea what it’s like to have an elite draft pick. A superstar. Elite. The last one we had was Iggy and he drove the team for over a decade. If you think Sven is that calibre of player you are dreaming. We have ZERO elite prospects. None.

            What is the point of trying to make the playoffs and just get spanked. Wouldn’t it be better to draft the next Iggy and move on with the hope of being a contender in 3-4 years. A team that EXPECTS to make the playoffs and worries about home ice advantage instead of praying we can claw into 8th.

            And don’t give me that LA won it from 8th, anything can happen once you get in BS. We all know that LA team was a miserable failure for the first half and had no business being in 8th. They were picked as a favourite before the season. LA was the best team in the west from the allstar break on last year. They were considered a contender from day 1, not a team perennially hoping and praying to claw into the playoffs.

            I’m so tired of being mediocre. Hoping to make the playoffs is lame. I want to be expected to make it and fight all year for positioning. With a 40 year old core and zero elite prospects that will never, ever happen.

            The reason mgmt keeps grinding away with this middling team is because fans are ok with it. I’m not, I hate the direction and I pray every day we lose the next 10 games in a row so that the team has no choice but to trade iggy and let him win the cup he deserves and will never win in Calgary while we finally get a chance to draft an ELITE prospect. As many have pointed out, drafting is risky, which is why we need top 3. There is little risk in the top 3 of a draft.

          • Kevin R

            Well said Kurt. The only thing I disagree with is that Edmonton jettisoned literally everything except Horcoff & Hemsky & they’re next. Calgary have some pieces. Calgary have veterans that can teach the young players how to win. Calgary does have some young players that I think its too soon to tell if they are elite or not. Sven, maybe, Gaudreau, maybe, Brossoit, maybe. But we are getting close to seeing whether they do or not. Oilers are sucking not only to get back elite players but they are now having visions of dynasty dancing in their heads. The nightmare in these visions is called Cap. We dont need 3 1st overalls to become a legit contender again but we do need to maximize our assets which happen to be hockey players. But dont worry about offending these players, thats why they get paid the big bucks, its comes with the business territory. Everything should be about winning the Cup, too many on here are forgetting what that lockout was all about, winning & money & they go hand in hand.

        • If your end goal is not the Stanley Cup……Then what’s the point of playing?

          I’m an Oilers fan so you can probably imagine the pain we as fans have endured.

          I personally found no comfort or difference wether the Oilers finished 9th-10th or 30,30,29

          If mediocrity is acceptable then I take a rebuild any day of the week, if you don’t have the payers to get to the Stanley Cup then what options are you left with?

          As a fan of the Oilers I have seen this cycle payed out before, it never gets better.

    • seve927

      cLYDE, your post from the FGD thread:

      “After a very very favorable schedule to start, the Flames are done. No one can actually think any differently. Please start looking at making the deals needed to move this franchise forward.”

      I had to look a little deeper, because I couldn’t figure out what you were talking about. Now I see. The combined records of the Flames opposition is 26-9-7. That is not including their records against the Flames. Very, VERY favourable schedule indeed. Should have been automatic points.

      • T&A4Flames

        Favorable in that we have played mainly at home including games against Anaheim who is not considered a playoff team by many. Also, we got Colorado on the back end of a back to back coming from Vancouver after being blown out by Edmonton and Vancouver in their 2 previous games. They also gave their back up his 1st start. Last night we played Chicago who were also playing their 3rd game in 4 nights and traveling from Vancouver after an overtime game. They also started their back up. I would say we have had a very favorable schedule.

  • Willi P

    Plain and simple the Flames don’t have the individual player skill/scoring touch to finish. They continue to make back-up goaltenders first stars as they have done the last couple of years. The effort is there but you need goals to win.

    Hudler, Cervenka, Sven, Goodreau, Backlund, Granlun are first steps in correcting the problem. We need to have patience and this may be an ideal year to grab a Nathan McKinnon in the draft to compliment the above ‘skills’list.

    Move some of the againg vets for some prospects and perhaps more importantly toughness as the current Flames are easy to play against and scare no one.

    If there is one past learning from our Darryl Sutter days is that we need to establish an identity of somekind before we can move forward.

      • Captain Ron

        Play to lose and draft Mackinnon?? Not part of my DNA and clearly would not be professional conduct….BUT I watch the young top 5 superstar Oilers and can’t help but think how bright the Oiler future looks. Did they play to lose and secure 1st overall draft picks?? hmmmm..I’ll let you decide?

        As a long time Flames fan I am getting tired of this boring act of relying on overpaid aging players and finishing middle of the pack, out of the playoffs and no chance of drafting decent prospects!

    • Plain and simple the Flames don’t have the individual player skill/scoring touch to finish.

      Calgary can’t seem to score through the early going, but this isn’t true. Alex Tanguay sports one of the highest career SH% in the league. Glencross and Hudler were league leaders in that category last year. Roman Cervenka was a KHL scoring leader. Dennis Wideman is one of the better scoring defenders in the NHL. Jarome Iginla is an 11-time 30 goal scorer. Mike Cammalleri scored 11 goals in just 28 games for the team after his trade last year and has managed 20+ goals in 7 seasons.

      The team has had it’s issues over the last few years and its future is murky for a number of reasons…but the early low SH% of the club overall isn’t indicative of its talent.

  • seve927

    Well said VF.Bad JUJU it is!Hope they find a way too push through it.Hudler Baclund,Glencross,Servenka have all been playing some exciting hockey,and definetely are fun to watch.

    To all those who said Hudler was overatrd and overpaid,What say thee now.

  • seve927

    hows iggy to the blues for rattie,dagostini, and a first. send butler the other way if need be. send kippa washington’s way for some of the wealth of youthful forwards. the short sprint to the playoffs is becoming a marathon of sorts for the flames.

  • supra steve

    If the Flames play like this all year, it bodes well for the future. This is how a team without a threatening top end needs to play in order to be competitive: 4-line attack. Never quit. Great game to watch, but frustrating as hell when nothing went in. But the entertainment value? off the charts.

    Counter that with last season. They were unbearable to watch, even when they won.

    I know which iteration of the Flames I prefer. (so far, at least).

  • hairhelmet

    Hawks Fan here. Besides consoling y’all for losing a point that should never have had any chance of being lost, I went through the trouble of signing up here for one incredibly burning question: What was up with Kiprusoff’s pants? It seemed that they were untied and flapping open like your uncle’s pants after Boxing Day dinner. Was he just wanting someone to ring the doorbell?

    Consolation: Ugh. We mostly got no joy out of those 2 points. On the other hand, we have been dreaming of Iginla for a few years now. Will trade you any player whose name starts with “Emer”. See how good he is? See?

    • Vintage Flame

      There is absolutely no chance I would trade Iginla for Emery, and I don’t think there is many people around here that would.

      Even if there were, the Flames would never make that deal either.

      • hairhelmet

        Yes, I know. I was being facetious. For one, Emery wasn’t even wanted by any other NHL team when we picked him up last year (oddly enough we won him in a claw machine game in the lobby of an Ontario Denny’s). And for another: as a Hawks fans I’d be thrilled to have Iginla as he’d likely convert us to strong Cup challengers, but as a hockey fan I’d hate to see him play anywhere else but Calgary.

  • RKD

    The between the legs attempted pass by Cervenka was sick. He is skilled but I think because of his blood clot issue it still may take him a while to get back to NHL conditioning level.

    Glencross was a beast so many chances I was screaming at my TV at how the Flames could not buy a goal. Backlund had some great chances too.

    Somehow Cammy and Iggy have got to get it going, we would have more than one win if we had two lines scoring.

    Clyde, Murray Edwards and Jarome are very good friends off the ice. Probably conflict of interest, but being buds with Jarome probably means he isn’t getting moved unless he asks for a trade or signs elsewhere in the summer. Edwards and the rest of the brass are still in the win now mode and a very slow transition to developing younger players.

    Kipper is the more interesting story, next season he’s only going to make 1.5 million which is very attractive to some teams who are dying for a solid goalie-Toronto, Philadelphia, etc. I think Cammy and Kipper would more likely be moved before Jarome would be.

  • seve927

    I am so sick of trade JI crap he is a flame forever and if you got a problem with that stop watchin. He is one of the best players all time and all I here is trade him did det trade stevey y no did col trade sakic no I don’t understand what you half ass fans think he owes us.let him retire as the best flame ever whatever the outcome.and yes this team is way better than their record so far.

    • Willi P

      Sorry Jason, I love Iggy, have his jersey but I want to win a cup. Iggy has made more money than most on this planet from plying his trade in the City of Calgary. He & his family are set for life. I do not feel we owe him anything. I have paid big $$$ as a Season Ticket holder & have witnessed how Iggy has played these last few years. His passion is not the same as 7-8 years ago. Its time for change. If he’s willing to sign for 4.0mill per & take his retirement contract provide 2nd-3rd line depth scoring & groom the kids, fine. But if we have to pay 6-7.0 mill a year for 4-5 years & watch what I have witnessed the last number of years, no thankyou. If we are in cap hell (remember the cap) because we are paying a guy 7.0mill to play a 3rd line & we cant sign up & coming young stars like Sven & Gaudreau & Brodie & Backlund & Cerevenka, then enjoy yourself & send me a postcard, as I will walk away from my tickets.

      • Captain Ron

        I agree with what you are saying on Iginla and a potential future contract with the Flames. I don’t necessarily have much of a problem with him staying here as long as his contract price is cap friendly for the future of the team. I would have to think/hope that management and ownership know this too. Any contract talks regarding Iginla would certainly involve ownership and management in a combined effort. Whatever the result I don’t think I will walk away from my tickets over it in protest though.

        A big problem for Iginla personally playing elsewhere might be knowing that he would no longer be “the guy” on another team such as Pittsburg for example. I can imagine this may not be an easy transition for someone like him to comprehend. It is certain to be in his decision process at some point if given the opportunity to move on.

        On another note I am thrilled to be watching some of the most entertaining hockey I have seen in the Dome in a long time. Last nights loss was heartbreaking but an entertaining affair none the less. There are some good things coming on the horizon.

        R.I.P Brent Sutter era and don’t ever come back with your boring snooze fests disguised as hockey games. I used to sometimes dread going to your games. Your hockey sucks badly on the entertainment scale.

        Welcome Bob Hartley! Your hockey style is waaaaaay more fun to watch and your positive nature is infectious. I hope you are able to keep it up for a long time to come. Your communication skills are so obviously better than that group we were subjected to for the last 9 or 10 years.

    • Vintage Flame

      The only problem with those analogies is that neither Colorado nor Detroit were in re-bilding situations when Sakic and Yzerman were entering the twilights of their careers.

      The closest analogy to the Flames and JI would be the Leafs and Sundin.

      I would LOVE to see Iggy retire as a Flame, I really would. But I think I’d like to see him come back to the team after a year or two elsewhere, where he had a legit shot at winning the Cup.

      It’s a win for the Flames because of the assets they could potentially get in return for him and it’s a win for Iggy because after all he deserves a Cup.

      Now, that being said, he also deserves the respect to allow him to rfetire wherever he wants. If it’s in Calgary, then so be it.

      • T&A4Flames

        Exactly how I feel.

        Also with Stevey Y and Sakic, they had won their championships. I want to see Iggy get one. I just can’t see it happening in CGY if he stays. Maybe in a couple years with some trade acquisitions maturing at that point.

    • Sakic and Yzerman captained teams to many play off series wins and about 7 Cups. I wouldn’t trade that either. They were great players who helped make their teams great. Iggy has been a great player on a mediocre team.

  • Willi P

    I really have noticed a trend. Stajan was thrown to centre Iggy, didnt work. Joker was acquired to centre Iggy, didnt work. We sacrificed our secondary scoring & future to get our #1 line untracked. Our identity is a team with no distinguished #1 line. Suddenly, Cheddar & Hudler & Backlund are starting to provide a secondary scoring threat we havent seen around here for some time. Stajan is a player again(1st 6 games anyway) We have to change this rut. As good as Hartley is, its like a pro swimmer getting pulled under the currents of the Bow river in the spring. Personally, right now we could trade Iggy & Cammi & this team would provide the same results & entertainment as we have seen so far this year & really not miss these guys whose cap hits are $14mill. In fact, I have been an advocate of trading JBO & now that I have seen the Hartley game, JBO, GIO, Wideman & Brodie are perfect for his system. We just need a rock solid, net clearing stay at home nasty shutdown dman & groom the next nastiest mean shutdown dman in our system (Wotherspoon or Seiloff I see in the future). Not sure what Cammis value is but get a 1st & the best possible NHL kid we can get for Iggy. We have to keep Kipper until we know Ramo can come or we have someone capable of playing regularly.

    Regardless of how we do in Feb, Feaster must move on from these players & with Sven & Johnny on the cusp, this thing can turn for us without the nuclear waste of a blowup. Right now, moving Iggy & Cammi does not even come close to constituting a blowup. In fact, if we stay healthy, our chances for playoffs would be the same. Sorry for the ramble but there are a lot of things I like what I have seen so far. Lets see if we feel this way March 1 when the heat the kitchen gets cranked up.

    • seve927

      Hey Kevin, nice to hear some arguments backed up with decent logic. I don’t know if I necessarily agree with everything – I think the key for this team to be successful (and no, the wins have not come yet), is having three lines that can score. You’ll never have all three scoring, but you work from the premise that you can have two lines scoring at any time. Cammy and Iginla haven’t scored yet, but they will and in bunches. They’ll need to because the other lines won’t always be scoring. But I do agree that cap space is going to be a problem and that 13M is not well spent. And yep, I love our top 4D and agree there’s a good chance of not only good players coming up, but good fits in the lineup. And yep, Kipper get gradually usurped by Ramo. Good post.

  • Willi P

    Agreed our defence I love don’t look that good yet but it will. I still would never trade iggy because no matter what we do we will not win lottery. No matter what happens this season our team IS on the right track. A lot of you fans bitched about feaster,well apologize. I hope no I know with a few minor tweaks and a little luck we could get as high as sixth but it also could reverse and we get tenth,either way no Jones or nate.all we can do as fans is watch buy and attend,but I will say this flames are very fun to watch because no team NO team has worse luck!

  • supra steve

    And why exactly can we not afford to move Kipper before his full time replacement has arrived and proven himself worthy? Kipper won’t play forever, and he will need to be replaced at some point soon, with or without a proven heir apparent. Would it have been terrible if Feaster had moved Kipper last year and we ended up drafting 5th instead of dealing down from 14th? I personally, would have loved that. Might also have given Iggy that extra nudge he needs to get him to accept the reality that this franchise will not be competing for a championship before he is retired, encouraging him to ask to be traded to a contender.

  • TheRealPoc

    For the love of Christ…we should have a mod here auto-nuking any post that contains “Jarome doesn’t have the same passion anymore.” Trying to think why else a veteran in his mid-30’s continually destroys his teammates in preseason fitness testing, but I’m drawing blanks.

    We already have to digest enough mindless rhetoric from the mainstream media that doesn’t stay up late enough to watch us play, I don’t think we to propagate awful, lazy narratives ourselves.

    • internuncial

      Get the goggles off buddy or put down that bong because I go to these games & the last 3 years I have never seen Iggy float at centre ice and fail to back check as much as I have seen him in the last 3 years. The odd thing is, if you read them at all, is that Kent & other writers on this site have statistics to prove Iggy isnt playing like the dominating player he used to be. Just because he is into the fitness side does not equate into passion on the ice. If you dont like what I have to say, I really could care less. If you prefer to bury your head in the sand, go fill your bucket.

  • Captain Ron

    @Kevin R

    I posted this a couple of days ago but not sure if you were able to read it so here it is again.

    I mentioned a couple of weeks ago that I had heard some things about Iggy that I would share. The source was a buddy of mine who’s job puts him shoulder to shoulder with sports and entertainment people from time to time. While at my place over the holidays he relayed to me some things he was told by one former Flame coach who eagerly bent his ear for a while over a couple of beers. Showed me a picture another buddy of his took while the two were talking to back it up. With regards to Iggy the ex coach did not think the Flames would win the cup with him on the team. He said that Iggy would often tell the team they were going to do things differently once he left the room. There were confrontations with him from time to time. He also said that he did not think the Flames would move Iginla and they would do what they could to try to keep him here for the rest of his career. My buddy did caution that he was also told by someone that night that what this particular ex coach said when he is having a couple of brew should be taken with a grain of salt. With regard to personal issues my buddy was also told by someone else that lockout life at home may not have been the best of times for Iginla and he was pretty happy to get back to playing again. Maybe there is something to that story. When looking at Iginla’s career here he really hasn’t had a lot of adversity to deal with that I can remember.

    • internuncial

      No I never did read that post. I have heard similar personal issue stories myself. I think there is a dynamic that will be very at play as to whether he resigns or not. Like you, I am really excited to see the complimentary pieces that Hudler, Cerevenka, Brodie, Backlund is stepping up are bringing to this team. Dejavu of 04 when Donavon Nillsen & Niemenen were scoring big goals & providing huge goals. When was the last time we saw the Flames attack in waves like last night. I’m more excited about this team than I ever thought I would be. But it’s time for changing of the guard. I have trouble understanding all these Iggy for lifers drum beaters. Why wasnt Maccinnis a Flame for life, or Suter, or Mikey Vernon or Fleury or Nieuy. They all moved on, some went on to win another Cup. All these guys won us a Cup, Iggy & Kipper havent. They will always be some the best Flame players in our history regardless where they finish their career.

  • I’m an Oilers fan, but I have to say that based on the start the Flames have had, they’re bound to turn this around. They’re second in the league in shots per game at 33.8, and second in shots against per game as well, allowing only 25 per night. Over the long haul the team has issues due to the age of the core, but right now they are playing at a very high level. It’s a hard thing for me to say, but if the Flames keep this up all year they’re in the playoffs.

    • Captain Ron

      Thanks for stopping by. There are a few others around here who agree with you. I think right now the losses are teaching more than wins would have. This may be a good thing. Having the puck more than the opposition for a change won’t hurt their cause either. Eventually the wins will come. I can also see them being a healthier team too in the long run with this style of play.

      BTW your team looks better this year than it has in a while too.

    • Vintage Flame

      Appreciate you coming by and letting the majority around here know that we’re not all just nuts.

      I agree that the Flames will undoubtedly turn this around. The one thing I do question is cif they will do it in time, that always seems to be teh main issue with this team.

      Making a season or playoff saving surge, only to fall short because they run out of games, and waste games in hand.

      It’s been a common fault over teh past few years, but I definitely see more promise in this group.

  • Captain Ron

    I know I am probably stating the obvious but Jiri Hudler is a much better hockey player than I had ever thought. He has been very well coached by the Wings. You could isolate this guy on camera and show it to others in a “this is how you should play” video. So much for the theory of him playing in the Datsuk or Zetterburg shadows. From my point of view he is totally legit on his own. Anyone who can come here and make Stajan look good has to have some good things going for him.

    Cervenka looks like a keeper too. Given some time to adjust this guy may well turn into an above average player in this league.

  • internuncial

    I just tuned in for the third period and all I have to say is that I never saw that much good, exciting, fast, dangerous, all-around hockey goodness from the Flames in any game (any month?) the entire time Butter was coach. I know, I know, the Hawks were tired and all that, but the Flames have played some tired teams in the past 3 years and they NEVER dominated a period like that. I don’t know what Hartley has changed, but, like, holy sh!t.

    Sometime last night I stopped thinking about the draft lottery…

  • T&A4Flames

    I think what some people on here seem to think is that we have to tank to get McKinnon or Jones. I just don’t think that is the case. This is a strong draft. Regardless of how we play, if we continue to drag the bottom depths, selling off a few vets, and that includes Iggy and Kipper if need be, and then maybe trading up could allow us 3 top 15 picks. Every draft has guys that slip in the draft for whatever reason. Remember Grigorenko just last year.

    I think so far this team has shown that is has some guys ready to take the mantle; no longer do we ‘need’ Iggy to carry the mail. I don’t want him to go but I do want him to win a cup.

    Our own pick could be top 5 if this continues. Trade and acquire 3 1st rnd’s and hopefully trade up. Maybe Barkov or Monohan,, or Ristolainen all slip to us. My point is, for the 1st time in a long time we don’t have to sell all our assets, because we only have a few, and sink to last to build up our future.

    • T&A4Flames

      I agree, except getting 3 top picks out of the top fifteen.Teams willing to give up there first rounders for Iggy and Kipper will be top 6 looking for a final push.That will dictate 20 to 30th picks,and i,am not sure how you can turn those into the 15th and lower.

    • We don’t HAVE tTO tank to get Mckinnon or Jones and it is a deep draft, but if aren’t going to make the playoffs, and losing to Colorado shows the same inconsistencies of the last few years then it is time to give Iggy and Kipper a chance somewhere. I love the way this team is playing but it obviously won’t be enough unless we start winning every game. My fear is that this team does pull it together to tease fans once again – we don’t trade iggy and lose him for nothing and again do not draft in the top 10 – Baertshi is great but not a franchise player who can carry this team. To be hones Mckinnon is exactly what this team needs. If we can’t get in the top 6 of this conference by March then Feaster should cripple us. Play Irving every other game and move some players.

    • T&A4Flames

      Do you honestly think that moving Iggy and Kipper will put us in the bottom of the league for 5 years. Keeping Iggy and Kipper will very soon ensure we are bottom of the league. They’re both still good players but soon, like next year or 2, they will not be able to do the roles they are currently expected to do, if they already aren’t there.

      • T&A4Flames

        To expand on this.., we brag about how we didn’t suck like the oilers. At least we aren’t as bad as them etc. but outside of Calgary other teams and fans around the NHL just see two teams who both missed the playoffs for the last 3 years. Neither team was a contender or a factor in any way.

        During those 3 years of futility, the Oilers got Taylor Hall, Ryan Nugent Hopkins, and Yakupov. Players who will transform their team for the next 10 years, maybe longer.

        Getting 9th place is easily the worst spot to finish. A few exciting games down the stretch hoping to grind into the playoffs are soon forgotten. Elite superstar draft picks transform your team for decades.

    • T&A4Flames

      I certainly commend your passion and dedication to this team. We just disagree on what needs to be done and that is what this form is for. You make some great points.

  • T&A4Flames

    TO @Gingras34:

    While I agree somewhat with some of your points, and that we do have some good prospects like gaudreau, baertshi, granlund etc… these are all sitll the complementary pieces like the Loobs and Hrdinas that you need to win (and some of them may not work out), but can’t carry your franchise. As an organization, the Flames need to address who will be the next Nieuwendyk, the next Iggy. Yes, as you point out losing Iggy would mean losing a 30+ scorer, but past management has put this team in a position that it has to find the future franchise players and fast. Trading Nieuwendyk was tough on the fans, but we know the how that story ended.

    Sutter put a great team together for 08-09, he sacrificed our future but it was a team that would have been a contender if not for our entire top 4 D being injured. That was bad luck, but as a rule: “It takes 5 years to build a team and then you try like hell to keep it together for 2 or 3 years.” Sutter started in 04 and it ended in 09. Sad to say, but it is time for this team to move.

  • Matty Franchise Jr

    Every game the Flames win in regulation is a game that someone ahead of them in the standings doesn’t get any points from. So there is some benefit to a shortened season – no Eastern Conference games.

  • Im curious as to how good of a handle Flames marketing (i.e. Ken King) has on the tolerance the season seat holders have for anything resembling a scorched earth rebuild.

    And in context…. trading iggy and kipper at this very late point in there useful life cycles probably doesn’t fetch anything representing a home run in current roster players coming back. Which leads one to the observation that an accumulation of draft picks is the most potential value likely available in a trade.

    Given recent picks… would one entrust the replacement of iggy and kipper in the organizations asset chest to this group of scouts and management?

    Clearly its not difficult to grab a good player out of Seth Jones and the two moose heads. Beyond that….

  • People can say theFlames ahve played well all they want. If that’s the case, it’ll be itneresting to see how they make out when they play poorly.

    I’ve liked Hudler and Cervenka so far. I can live with Wideman too, like I’ve said before, he’s as advertised and his contract is too long, but I can live with that.

    Iginla’s been a selfish 1-dimensional floater for years now. He sure as hell doesn’t belong in the same conversation as Sakic and Yzerman.

    Iginla, Cammi and Kipper are all worth more at the deadline though. When are people going to realize it’s not 2004 anymore? Iginla era is over and he needs to be jettisoned so that the team can move on. New leadership is required.

    All 3 of those pieces would net decent returns at the deadline. And I’d consider JBo, but the potential in the return would have to be really worth it.

    Ramo steps in next year. Sure, it’s a gamble, but one worth taking.

    Backlund, Baertschi, Glencross, Stempniak, Hudler, Cervenka and Tanguay – I can live with all those guys. They can all skate, they all work hard and they can all contribute offensively or at least on possession.

    The team doesn’t tank into oblivion, but they also potentially receive some picks and/or prospects who start filling in the holes.

    No team wins the Cup without 3 or 4 superstars in their 20’s and frankly, I only care about winning the Cup and not 9th or 10th. The fact that some fans are happy with that shows just how long Calgary has been a loser club.

    Sorry, but Iginla isn’t leading us anywhere, especially next year at 36 years old. Get over it and move on.

    And while fans here are once again fawning over the current group of prospects as though we were the Pilers circa 1979, they’d best be advised to go back and read the press clippings and fan hype over the previous few generations of prospects. Not nearly as many make it to the NHL work out as well once in the NHL as people speculate.

    We have improved in that area, but some fans here act as though Baertschi is good for 40 this year and Gaudreau is a lock for a p/pg next season.

    Point is this: Calgary needs more young top end talent and the draft is the only way to do that and in order to get and quickly, they need to acquire more picks. 2013 is both high end and deep so the team had better not blow their last good chance at real change.

    Which they probably will.

    • ^ what he said!!

      People saying they don’t trust the scouts and draft picks outside the top 3 are risky. I agree! Simple solution. Get 29th or 30th. Then you are guaranteed top 3. Simple.

      I’d suggest that trading kipper anytime soon would do the trick. No kipper and this team is done. Iggy will ask out. Presto.

      People expecting Sven to be the new superstar Iggy should share what they are smoking with the rest of us.