Evaluating Sean Monahan Without Johnny Gaudreau

In his final year of college hockey, Johnny Gaudreau led his team in scoring by 15 points over just 40 games. The second and third best scorers for Boston College were his regular line mates Kevin Hayes (65) and Bill Arnold (53). The best point total managed by a “non-Gaudreau” player was Patrick Brown (30). 

This situation is playing itself out again in the NHL with the Flames. Gaudreau currently has a team-best 39 points. Second and third on the team are Sean Monahan (25) and Jiri Hudler (20). At this pace, Gaudreau could lead the Flames by 30+ points by the end of the year.

Gaudreau’s offensive potency is relevant in a discussion of Sean Monahan because the two players have been connected at the hip since about December of 2014. Like Gaudreau, Monahan is set to become a restricted free agent this summer and as Pat Steinberg recently reminded us, he’s going to get paid

It is therefore vital for the Flames to evaluate Sean Monahan’s individual contributions, which means: how good is Monahan without Gaudreau?

Monahan With and Without Gaudreau

Luckily there’s an easy way for us to look at this thanks to the tools at Puckalytics.com. Here’s what I found when I looked at the two players together and separately over the last two and half seasons:

Player TOI GF GA GF60 GA60 GF% Sh% Sv% PDO CF CA CF60 CA60 CF%
Together 938:06:00 43 39 2.75 2.49 52.4 10.07 91.86 101.9 830 939 53.09 60.06 46.9
SEAN MONAHAN 1712:09:00 59 76 2.07 2.66 43.7 8.35 91.2 99.5 1381 1768 48.4 61.96 43.9
JOHNNY GAUDREAU 701:57:00 37 31 3.16 2.65 54.4 11.49 90.46 102 629 689 53.76 58.89 47.7

That’s a lot of numbers and acronyms, but the main stuff to look at is GF% (ratio of goals for and goals against) and CF% (possession rate). 

As you can see, Monahan and Gaudreau together outscore the bad guys at even strength, even though they are slightly underwater in terms of possession. That’s over about 940 minutes of ice time together. 

The instructive information is below that. Alone, Monahan’s results plummet across the board: his corsi falls to 43.9% and his GF% dips well into the red at 43.7%. What’s interesting is his on-ice SH% also falls to a completely average 8.35%, whereas he is well above average when skating with Johnny (it’s possible Gaudreau is one of the very rare forwards who drives SH%. Monahan, who despite being a pretty effective sniper, may not). These results are over 1700 minutes of ice, so not an insignificant amount of time. 

It’s tempting to conclude that Gaudreau and Monahan form a deadly duo and their chemistry (plus the lack of other quality options) is the reason for the large disparity between the two data sets. 

Notice, however, that Gaudreau’s results are slightly better away from Monahan. Over 700+ minutes of ice time without Monahan as his centre, Gaudreau’s CF% (47.7) and GF% (54.4) both marginally improve. This reduces the possibility that the two players form a kind of symbiotic chemistry that benefits them both.

To put this in more concrete numbers: with Gaudreau, Monahan has been on the ice for 43 goals for and 39 goals against at ES (+4). Away from Gaudreau, Monahan has been outscored 76 to 59 (-17). Gaudreau away from Monahan has outscored the competition 37 to 31 (+6).  

Discussion

I was shocked with how stark the WOWY results are. I expected Gaudreau to have a positive effect, but not to such a large degree. 

We can’t necessarily assume this solely reflects disparate skills levels. We might, for example, be able to put this down to role: away from Gaudreau, Monahan’s zone start ratio falls below 50% (47%), which means Monahan might be doing some of the dirty work when he’s not skating with Gaudreau, which would naturally suppress his output somewhat.

In addition, a big chunk of Monahan’s time away from Johhny is captured in his rookie season, which we can assume was Monahan at his weakest. That said, I isolated Monahan’s WOWY re: Gaudreau this season and it’s still abysmal: 

With: GF% = 54.8, CF% = 47.6

Without: GF% = 35.7%, CF% = 39.4% 

Gaudreau away from Monahan: GF% = 42.9%, CF% = 53.4%

We’re dealing with sample size issues here since Monahan has only played about 80 minutes away from Johnny this year, but the pattern more or less holds (though Johnny’s GF falls while his CF improves). 

Conclusion

The pertinent issue here isn’t necessarily that Gaudreau improves Monahan’s results; it’s that Monahan (at least over the sample of data we currently have) gets completely beat up away from Gaudreau. 

This is relevant when considering contract extensions for both guys this summer – if Monahan can’t be effective at ES unless he’s stapled to Gaudreau, it raises very serious questions about the org backing up the Brinks truck for the 21-year old. After all, there’s no guarantee that the two guys will be line mates forever. 

  • RedMan

    Monahan needs to play with speedy grinders. Byron, Jooris, Ferland.

    Instead he gets used with Colborne, Hudler, etc away from Gaudreau. He’s not that kind of line driving centre.

  • KACaribou

    Johnny Hockey is a superstar. He improves everyone. It’s blasphamy to s#@t on either of these youngsters, but of course Mony benefits from JH. Of course shooting percentages go up, because the number of quality chances increase because Johnny Hockey is so damend good. Mony has wonderful hands and a nose for the net. But he’d have more room, better opportunities, and more scoring results, if he added a little mean to his game in my opinion.

  • calgaryfan

    Thanks Kent. I hope the Flames are reading this as a long expensive contract could really put the team in a bad place. Monahan is young and has time to improve so a bridge deal is what the Flames should be offering. He is not really a top line centre as Mr. Steinberg believes. Monahan may become that centre and the Flames will have to pay him, but not now.

  • SmellOfVictory

    Great article. I’d really like to see in-depth what the other wingers Monahan plays with do to his numbers, and what their numbers are, in general. The Flames aren’t exactly awash in possession-driving wingers, and I don’t think Monahan has had much/any time with Frolik and Bennett (certainly not while away from JG).

  • Toofun

    If the Flames use this data it drives Monahan’s value down a bit and drives Gaudreau’s up. The latter will get a contract before the former because if someone else offersheet’s Monahan the compensation will be decent and the Flames still have Bennett. On the other hand, there is no one that can replace Johnny Hockey.

    • KACaribou

      For the love of gawd, let’s assume and hope the Flames don’t use any data they find on FN to make their corporate decisions. Anyone who thinks they are making that kind of difference is fooling themselves.

      Not to say that you were suggesting that Wot96, it just seemed a little that way when I read it.

      • KACaribou

        Oh my gawd some people here do think they are influencing the hockey experts the Flames employ! That’s delusional folks. Myself included, we don’t know squat compared to those people. The good news is that they don’t know your jobs either and you are far more an expert at it (providing you have a job. We are in NDP Alberta!).

      • KACaribou

        The point is that the team will look at wowy stats from whatever source they use and come to their own conclusions. Those conclusions will be used to mitigate Monahan’s contractual ask, if they can. Because of the cap crunch next year, if the Flames can only keep one player, it will be Johnny. While Mony is a shooter, I think he will be the odd man out.

        As an aside, I am going to assume that Kent’s stats are accurate because that is kind of the point of the blog. So the fact this was raised on FN should be irrelevant to the Flames Org.

  • Toofun

    We all watched Monahan and Getslaf last night. Neither scored a goal but one of them was noticable everytime he was on the ice. Maybe it’s more fair to compare Monahan to Perry since they are both finishers? In that case it was a closer comparison I guess.

    • SmellOfVictory

      Agreed. Last season I think they were tracking for roughly identical contracts, but at this point Johnny is worth a solid million AAV more than Monahan (if we’re hoping that he and his agent are kind to the Flames).

  • beloch

    Nice analysis Kent.

    To my eyes, Monahan is great at crashing the net and tipping pucks in. His hand-eye-stick coordination is nothing short of fantastic. We’ve seen that on numerous occasions when Monahan batted a puck out of mid-air into the back of the net. Possession wise, he still looks like a 21-year-old sometimes. The only younger player on the team is Bennett, which is easy to forget. Gaudreau’s game has had an extra year to mature. Still, Monahan’s skill-set is very complementary to Gaudreau’s. Johnny can land pucks on Monahan’s stick using improbable plays, and Monahan is good at burying those chances.

    Monahan isn’t the slick play-maker that Gaudreau is. He doesn’t rob his opponents of the puck as regularly as Gaudreau does. He can’t dance his way through and out of coverage the way Gaudreau can. This is a totally unfair comparison because Gaudreau is a sublime talent. He breaks the game and embarrasses top competition on a regular basis.

    As good as Gaudreau is, there aren’t many 21-year-olds in the league who could take advantage of “Gaudreau-effect” the way Monahan has. Gaudreau is already great, but Monahan is going to be darned good in a few years. The Flames need to sign both of these kids long-term. If this is done, the only reason to break these two up will be because Bennett muscles Monahan out of the top-line. It’s a good time to be a Flames fan!

  • KACaribou

    I don’t think that this analysis holds a lot of water. By including Monahan’s rookie season (i.e. a whole season without JG) it skews the data. I’d be more interested in seeing the numbers for just this and last season before drawing conclusions.

  • CofRed4Life

    Of course JG makes Monahan better. I believe they complement each other quite well. One is a great playmaker while the other is a great finisher. A playmaker without a finisher doesn’t do well, and a finisher without a playmaker doesn’t do well. That’s why they’re such great linemates together.

    • Flames Fan in Edmonchuck

      Except that Johnny does excel without Moneyhands. Look I think this is all to say that S.Money is good, just not “scored 30 goals in my second year and on pace for 30ish this year elite number one center in the making so pay me 8X8” good… solid solid player, growing all the time will be good, maybe great but not a franchise conerstone. (I think Bennett might be that center)

  • Kevin R

    You have players that have the ability to make most players better. they are rare & we are blessed to have one in Gaudreau. I think McDavid has that as well & I wonder if stats would show that Gretszky made Kurri better. Bottom line, when the Oilers found one of the most prolific hockey pairs in NHL history, they didn’t separate them. I see no need to separate Johnny & Monny. You need to surround these guys with top level talent & they will feed off of each other & win games for you. That play that Gaudreau faked the drop pass to a crossing Monahan & walked in for a top scoring chance was a thing of beauty. It’s why we need to find someone for Bennett so we can throw out two young lines that will just do a number on you on any given night.

    I think Gaudreau will get paid more but really, how much less will actually make Monahan pout & feel unappreciated? One gets 7.0 mill & the other get’s 6.0mill per. Both should get inked for 7 or 8 years at these numbers. Don’t even think twice about it as a GM.

    • KACaribou

      Gretzky – 1st season in the NHL – had Blair McDonald on his line. BJ scored 46 goals that season. Gretzky was a teenager still and “only” had a 137 point season. Partway though the next season Blair was traded to Vancouver. Fans and media questioned Sather for trading the 46-goal-scorer and Sather quipped back that a refridgerator could probably score 50 goals on Wayne Gretzky’s line. BJ could only muster another 88 games in the NHL after the trade.

      Point being. Yeah, Jari Kurri benefitted. I don’t need advanced stats to tell me that. I saw and remember it.

      • Kevin R

        Where I beg to differ is that Kurri still had some pretty big seasons after Wayne was traded to LA & he & Messier won another Cup. So yes & then again, you still need to put very talented players together with these kind of rainmaker type of players. & yes I saw it & remember it too. In fact I took Messier & Kurri in a playoff pool that year they won & those two won me $1000 going away. No one was even close.

        • KACaribou

          Essentially you are correct Kevin, but there is a pretty obvious drop off for Kurri after Gretzky got traded. I wasn’t trying to imply he wasn’t still a valuable player. Hockey pools were so innocent back in those days. $1,000 is a pretty big haul.

          • Kevin R

            🙂 It was $100 entry & there were 16 of us. I was going to University boy did that $$$ come in good. In fact I picked around 12th & kinda got stuck with picking them. So as much as I hated watching them win another Cup, I profited from it. I still utilize that technique today, I took McDavid in one of my pools that I usually do crummy in because I always get so many friggin injuries & he didn’t let me down.

            On another note, I don’t think anyone in LA or St Louis or Rangers ever saw the bump from Gretz the way Kurri did, which tells me yes, he got the huge bump but he was very talented & together, they were nothing short of lethal. Which I sure would love to see from Gaudreau & Monahan.

  • MattyFranchise

    Using puckalytics like Kent did I looked at Toews and Kane (arguably the best one-two punch in the game today) during their entry level contracts and Toews and Kane together over three full seasons finished with GF% of 60.3 and CF% of 58.4.

    Toews on his own was 56.9 GF% and 57.0 CF%
    Kane on his own was 47.7 GF% and 54.4 CF%

    In their second contracts Kane got 6.3 million per for 5 seasons and Toews got the same which was 9.7% of the cap when their contracts began in the 2011/12 season.

    Today, 9.7% of the cap would be $6.925. Given that neither player is as good by the numbers that Kent chose to use I’d be happy with 6.3 for Monahan and 6.75 for Gaudreau though I’d prefer that both of them got 7 million even for 6 seasons or so.

  • KACaribou

    FN Question: Has anyone checked out ON? They routinely get 50, 100, 200 or more comments to a blog. It’s impressive.

    FN: 10, 20 or 30? More if a game in on and some people comment on every play that pees them off.

    What’s the difference? Any opinions?

    • MontanaMan

      Oilers fans are pretty passionate about their team good or bad. When it’s good they are winning the Stanley Cup and when it’s bad they want everyone fired and/or traded. Is the discussion any more relevant than FN? I don’t think so. But you are correct that there are a lot more comments but many of them are “Justin Schultz sucks” or “Kevin Lowe should be fired” so I’m not sure how much value there is. I liken it to a FN discussion where there are 50 intelligent comments or 150 comments bordering stupidity. I will take quality over quantity.

      With no disrespect to FN contributors, I find the quality of ON articles much better. ON has an excellent and diverse group of writers.

    • Out of the 200 comments on there, 40 will be intelligent. There are some very obviously smart and knowledgeable hockey fans on ON but the opposite is also true. I have stopped going over there at all except when something big comes up.

      • Exactly. I was on there after the win over them and it’s nothing but one idiot trying to be wittier than the other. 20% of comments being intelligent is an overestimation though; probably closer to 5%. Nothing but ‘fans’ who want to nuke everything when they lose and gloat like crazy when they’re winning. It’s beneath juvenile and a waste of time.

        No wonder Rex comes over here to post. Anything coherent there gets lost in the fog of stupidity and an intelligent debate is impossible.

        I don’t want FN to be like that. Or like CP. FN has always been about civil debate and discussion on an intellectual level and I hope it stays that way.

    • RedMan

      there are more guys there living in mom’s basement that never change out of sweat pants… and ogle the internet all day. Calgary is a bit older/more mature (Generally,not everyone).

  • KACaribou

    I can see so many problems with this analysis.

    1) Monahan’s PDO is less than Gaudreau’s, suggesting he *may* be less lucky.

    2) Including Monahan’s rookie stats is ridiculous, especially since he was on the 4th worst team in the league and was just 18 (compared to Gaudreau who was 21 when he entered the league).

    3) Monahan has both harder competition and worse zone starts away from Gaudreau. Remember when he had to be our only good centre to start last year, when Backlund was injured? He was facing the best competition while carrying GlenX and Jones (both of whom did much better with Monahan than away iirc).

    4) Away from Monahan, Gaudreau has had better quality of line mates. Monahan was on the 3rd/4th line for a good amount of his first 100 games, and even when he was in the top 6, our wingers were not very strong until he got with Gaudreau. On the other hand, Gaudreau has had top 6 minutes his entire career.

    5) Monahan is as old now as Gaudreau was when he entered the league. Gaudreau had 3 years of college development before entering the league, while Monahan doesn’t even have 3 years of hockey experience out of Junior yet!

    These are just the ones I had off the top of my head, I’m sure there are more factors.

    I’m not saying that Monahan is better or even as good as Gaudreau, but the WOWY numbers that they show do not paint the whole story at all and can definitely be justified in a way other than saying that Monahan ‘needs Gaudreau stapled to his wing.’ All the people who say that he isn’t ‘taking over games’ or ‘creating stuff for himself’ obviously are forgetting his amazing play even before he was with JG. He doesn’t play a flashy style, but he is so good at positioning himself all over the ice, which creates space for his linemates. Look at that Gaudreau chance half way through the 1st last night, where Monahan cut straight across the ice to allow Gaudreau to have a clear shot, and the he almost got the rebound despite it being much closer to the defender.

    Look at this post (https://www.reddit.com/r/CalgaryFlames/comments/2nf5wv/monahan_has_been_absolutely_unbelievably_great/) that was made last year at the 22 game mark, a month ot two before he was put with Johnny. He was already playing like a top line centre before being put with Monahan, and was on pace for basically the same totals as he ended up with last year even when he was playing with Jones and GlenX.

    Monahan is gonna be a star in his own right. Unfortunately for him, he will likely forever be in Gaudreau’s shadow, much like Backstrom with Ovi.

  • KACaribou

    The one thing immediately noticeable about ON is the Mod isn’t interfering with the readers’ comments. I just read three backhanded insults that I have never seen here without some juvenile warning to treat each other like you would at the playground.

    I’ve been in enough locker rooms to know the way typical guys talk to each other. It rings true on ON.

    • SmellOfVictory

      The way friends talk to each other, not random strangers on the Internet. Would you seriously insult a random person on the street and expect them to take it as a joke?

      There’s also a huge difference between ribbing someone and the kind of angsty yapping that certain people do here.

  • SmellOfVictory

    Haven’t read all the comments, so maybe this was pointed out and discussed already, but isn’t this analysis at best incomplete? I will illustrate using a purposefully extreme example. Imagine that that there are two people that Monahan gets paired with. Gaudreau, and Bollig. In this situation, all of Monahan’s “without Gaudreau” numbers are being dragged down by the proverbial anchor. Anyway, just strikes me as incomplete.

  • Plumsrus

    Pay the kid! For years we always asked our one supper star Iginla if he made the players around him better? Johnny makes all of them better. He not only raises the level of the players on the ice, he gets the fans out of there seats. He will generate enough excitement in the stands and on the ice for years. a max contract at seven for eight will payoff for this club. just think in a few years when we are serious contenders for the cup what a player like him will do to attract the top end free agents, as they will want to come here hopefully on good deals..

    • VoRaCS

      I have been waiting a long time for someone to share this type of analysis with the hope that decision makers will not make a mistake by overpaying Monahan at this point in his career. He has certainly been a decent player at times, but for whatever reason his hype seems far greater than his performance. I agree that he has scored some clutch goals, but notice how he has scored most of them. Sadly, pucks often die on his stick and I often find myself wishing that Bennett—a more skilled player—would play with Johnny more regularly—at least on the power play (but that’s another subject altogether).

      Personally, I would have no problem if the Flames locked up Johhny for 7-8 million a year for the maximum term; however, I’d prefer to see a bridge deal (3-4 million) for his linemate. I’m not advocating it, but an intriguing question to ponder is what Monahan could bring the Flames if he was traded.

      • piscera.infada

        I think that’s a decidedly bleak outlook on Monahan. I’ll preface this comment by saying I’ve never been in the “Monahan is Toews” group, nor do I believe “Monahan is the de facto first-line centre of the future”. I will also agree that Bennett, at least in theory, is the more skilled player between the two–I also think he has the higher ceiling.

        That all said, I don’t think Monahan is as bad as you seem to outline here, or as this article paints him via WOWY analysis. Yes, Gaudreau is the better player, and yes, Monahan has a long way to go especially in his two-way game, but none of that is to say he’s not worth a long-term deal.

        One of the most valuable skills in the NHL is the ability to actually deposit the puck in the net. I will agree that’s not the be all, end all in terms of being an effective player, it is often what separates the great players in the league from the middling ones. It’s not fair to Monahan to overlook the fact that a 21 year-old in the most difficult league in the world, has already scored 65 goals before the end of his entry-level contract.

        The question is then, if Monahan is currently not on the current iteration of the Flames, who is going to make up for the goals he’s generated? Last year, only 11 players in the entire league scored more times than Monahan. Sure, you can say he was the beneficiary of Gaudreau on some of those, however, I have a difficult time seeing any other currently-rostered centre (Backlund, Stajan, Jooris, Colborne) putting up those totals playing with Gaudreau. Now, you’ll notice I left Bennett off that list of “rostered centres”, and yes, that was by design. Bennett could eclipse or meet those totals. But as of right now, he has 8 goals in 46 career games (including last year’s playoffs). It’s hardly a certainty.

        I bring all this up, because in terms of a new contract, these numbers will be brought up. As I’ve said countless times, contracts are not negotiated in a vacuum–everything matters. As easy as it is for us to sit here and say “Monahan is a better player with Gaudreau, pay him significantly less both in dollars and term”, it’s nearly impossible to make that the sole argument in contract negotiations.

        You must negotiate contracts both based on a player’s future, but also their current role on the team. While Monahan might not be the elite number-one centre some build him up to be, that is how he is currently deployed for the most part, and his goal totals put him in a relatively small group of players that at his young age, makes him even more valuable.

        Now add to this, that he and Gaudreau will–rightly, or not–remain inextricably linked for a size-able amount of time. I’m not sure that from an optics point of view, it makes proper business sense to low-ball Monahan based on WOWY analysis, and some sort of “plan” that contrary to how he has been utilized over the past 2-plus years, it is expected he takes a step backwards in role.

        None of this is to say “back up the brinks truck for Monahan” in the same way the organization will have to for Gaudreau. I agree that a financially prudent contract is more important for Monahan than it is for Gaudreau. However, a “bridge deal ([at] 3-4 million)”, isn’t, by any means, going to “cut it” in contract negotiations with Monahan. That would be an absolute non-starter, and Treliving would be laughed out of the room. Again, contracts are not negotiated in a vacuum, they matter. Low-balling Monahan not only signals the organization under-valuing him, but signals to the rest of the team how truly serious you are about giving players their correct valuation as well. Look, in an ideal world, were I the GM of the Flames, I’d lock up every player for grossly under what they’re worth relative to the rest of the league, but we all know the NHL marketplace is not a “perfect world”.

        On one final note; trading Monahan, no. We can dispatch with this notion right now. I find it fascinating that large portion of the Flames fan-base is spilt into two groups with regard to Sean. The first greatly overvalues what he brings (the “Toews group”, if you will), the other seems to overlook the fact that the player has produced at the NHL level as a 19, 20, and 21 year old centre on a pretty poor to mediocre team, and drastically undervalues him because he’s not “elite in all areas of his game”. I agree Monahan has a long ways to go to maximize his potential. So does Bennett. However, I still forsee a situation where with both, you can end up with am extremely formidable one-two punch at centre for years, regardless of how the order of the two shakes out–‘Monahan/Bennett’ does not have to be a zero-sum game from either a contractual, or ice-time perspective. Thing is, you will have to pay both of them in order to maintain that.

          • piscera.infada

            What would be wrong with that, would be failing to pay him as a #2 center and simultaneously failing to develop a different player (Bennett or Jankowski) as a #1 center.

            Prime Monahan would be up there with guys like Jeff Carter and Stamkos as an elite 1B

  • KACaribou

    I noticed Joni Ortio lost but made 40 saves the other night for a .952 save percentage. Not a mention by the FN writers who like the skewer the young goaltender every chance they get.

    • Tomas Oppolzer

      It wasn’t written about because a quality start from him this year has been a bit of an anomaly. The Heat have routinely outshot their opponents by 20 SOG and have still lost 5-3. I’ve always been a fan of Ortio, he’s had a rough year though. I hope he pulls it together, but he’s left his team out to dry for the most part.

      • KACaribou

        Hi Tom. I was about this close to agreeing with you, but then I though… hmmmmmmm. People are mostly making these judgements about Ortio without really having seen him play or what kind of goals he has been letting in.

        I really think if he had the fortune of getting his starts at the beginning of the year with the Flames as they are playing now, he’d be our full time backup.

        Unfortunately Coach Bob was not in the position to trust his ‘tending the way his team was playing and so he sat… and sat… and sat… and then finally lost all confidence or so it seemed.

        Unless you have actually somehow seen Jani play this year in Stockton? In that case I would have to believe what you are telling me considering you aren’t a hater.

        • Kevin R

          Thing you should know is that Ortio declined a conditioning stint. He’s toast with this team & I doubt the Flames even resign him. If they do, I can almost guarantee it’ll be a two-way deal. If Gilles was healthy & Poulin healthy as well, Ortio may very well be toiling in the ECHL in Addy.

        • Tomas Oppolzer

          I’ll admit I haven’t seen every game. I’ve seen a few though (online obviously, I didn’t fly to Stockton) and he hasn’t looked good. I hope he can get back to his previous level of play, but so far he’s had bad game after bad game.

          As for Bob not starting him, I agree with that. Ortio was on the shelf way too long.

  • hulkingloooooob

    it’s funny, that game last night got me thinking about this and then you print the article. I’m wondering if it might be nice to try separating them for a bit to see what we really have in each talent (though i think we all know what we have in johnny). for a while i figured the’d both just get 6 mil per and we’d go forward from that, but now i’m not so sure. i love mony but no team can afford to over pay these days. so, if we were to use a good swath of this season as an experiment, what lines would you like to see keeping johnny and mony apart? for starters, i was thinking last night how fun it could be to watch johnny and sam play on a line. but they’d need some sort of hero to keep their heads above water….thoughts?

  • piscera.infada

    Soooo let me get this straight we compare Sean to Johnny with no regard to the fact that they play different positions? Kent I’ve noticed a strong negative sentiment regarding Monny in your last few articles can I ask why? Is it your underlying belief he isn’t as good as we all think?

  • KACaribou

    That’s really too bad. Goaltending is a funny business. I am pretty good with Ramo right now, and I wasn’t big on him before. Not sure who could have given us better goaltending than Ramo in the past month or so.

  • Derzie

    I am in the extreme minority here but I don’t really look at this from a fantasy stats perspective. I look at it as a fan and the questions are quite simple: Do I want Monahan on the team? Absolutely. Long term? Absolutely. Is he a core team member? Absolutely. How much should he get paid? I don’t care as long as both sides are happy. Making one side too happy is bad for the team (i.e. don’t insult/lowball him and don’t overpay relative to his teammates). Players that chase money when they are given fair offers, come across as selfish to me. The stink of greed on either side never washes off. We all remember the deals that got ugly. It stays with a player/GM forever.

    Doing a WOWY is not really fair. We all know that JG and Sean are a pair unless something is going wrong. So the Monahan WO Johnny will certainly be worse given that Johnny is becoming elite. Without crunching any numbers, one would expect a drop off aprt from JG as there is no reason to break up the duo except for bad line changes and bad performance.